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Old 17th April 2017, 10:39 PM   #751
Statitica
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On a slightly different note: Vulkan - worth getting hyped about, or set to fail while dx12 goes gangbusters?
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Old 18th April 2017, 12:13 PM   #752
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On a slightly different note: Vulkan - worth getting hyped about, or set to fail while dx12 goes gangbusters?
I can't speak for gaming, but in the Pro3D world Vulkan is taking off. It's answering a lot of questions to the needs people have been having for a long time. Previously 3-4 different APIs hobbled together was the answer (OpenGL, OpenCL, DirectX, CUDA, etc). But now Vulkan makes all that faffing about disappear.

So it depends what you mean by "fail". If you mean "will it be the API of choice for Microsoft Windows game developers?", I'm not sure. If they're Windows-only and/or XBox-only, then DX12 makes a bit of sense. But in this day and age, everyone's multi-platform to try and hit the widest audience possible (even indie devs), so coding either for something like Vulkan or ignoring the problem all together and just using a pre-baked engine like Unity or Unreal (both of which will target anything you like, which means OpenGL/Vulkan for anything non-Microsoft) is far more tempting.

I think the answer will be for Triple-A studios doing their own PC games and engines, DX12 will likely be their primary focus still for a while. Ditto for indie devs who only target Windows/PC/Steam. For everyone else who is targeting everything (including PS4, Switch, iOS, Android, etc), Vulkan from the get-go dramatically reduces the number of things to test on top of already complex multi-platform testing.
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Old 18th April 2017, 3:51 PM   #753
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Note that there is not much difference architecturally between DX12 and Vulkan. So porting games from windows to linux should be easier than say DX11 to OpenGL.

Vulkan on linux will be the premier 3d api for games. OpenGL will be continued to be supported and used for many years to come.

An interesting project is VK9 - https://github.com/disks86/VK9/wiki - implementation of DX9 in Vulkan. Could be interesting to have in wine for those games that won't get ported. All depends on how good a performance they will get as the project moves along.
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Old 19th April 2017, 4:13 PM   #754
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I can't speak for gaming, but in the Pro3D world Vulkan is taking off. It's answering a lot of questions to the needs people have been having for a long time. Previously 3-4 different APIs hobbled together was the answer (OpenGL, OpenCL, DirectX, CUDA, etc). But now Vulkan makes all that faffing about disappear.
That's very interesting.

I think you're right generally. I think Vulkan might be a gradual thing and it really won't be DX12 v Vulkan, it'll be DX13 v Vulkan that will be more interesting.

I suspect Microsoft will pump hundreds of millions into DX to try to prevent Vulkan getting a foot-hold. Ultimately it'll be the game developers who will decide the fate of it (as it relates to gaming). I think i read here that Microsoft is already doing the MS Store exclusive bullsh!t, as an example of their might. They could easily 'support' devs to use DX. They're not going to let Vulkan take the share off DX without one almighty fight.

Vulkan has some serious backing, so at least there is muscle enough to compete financially:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khronos_Group#Members
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Old 19th April 2017, 5:49 PM   #755
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FWIW - from Android 7 onwards, Vulkan is supported. And since Android is the biggest installed OS in the world, Vulkan will not go away for a long while
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Old 19th April 2017, 6:18 PM   #756
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Vulkan has some serious backing, so at least there is muscle enough to compete financially:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khronos_Group#Members
Vulkan is the same lot of people as OpenGL, OpenCL, and a tonne of other APIs.

From an install base point of view, they make Direct X look tiny. Folks need to remember that everything that's NOT a Microsoft product - i.e.: every phone, every display device, every electronic gizmo and gadget, every display in cars and planes and dashboards and a bunch of other crap - are all NOT Microsoft.

PC Gamers really need to step outside from time to time. OpenGL and now Vulkan have an enormous user base already, even without gamers. Add in gamers, and you've got every Sony and Nintendo console, every non-Windows mobile phone and tablet (which outnumber desktop PCs right now).

It's fun to sit on a forum full of PC gamers and think we're the only folks in town. The reality is PC gamers are a tiny fish in a very large pond.
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Old 19th April 2017, 6:56 PM   #757
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Out of interest, elvis, what do you mean by "the Pro3D world"?
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Old 19th April 2017, 6:57 PM   #758
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Out of interest, elvis, what do you mean by "the Pro3D world"?
CAD, CAM, DCC, VFX, post production, etc, etc.

These days you could even extend that to anyone using OpenCL, CUDA or Vulkan for general compute.
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Old 19th April 2017, 8:10 PM   #759
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CAD, CAM, DCC, VFX, post production, etc, etc.

These days you could even extend that to anyone using OpenCL, CUDA or Vulkan for general compute.
Maybe I'm still too ingrained with the windows world, but I had thought that most of that (CAD on autodesk, PP with Adobe CC, for example) would have remained in the realm of windows.

Or are you some kind of Wine sorcerer?
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Old 19th April 2017, 9:20 PM   #760
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Maybe I'm still too ingrained with the windows world, but I had thought that most of that (CAD on autodesk, PP with Adobe CC, for example) would have remained in the realm of windows.
Not even close. Think of every movie you've watched in the last 20 years. 90% made on Linux.
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Old 19th April 2017, 11:50 PM   #761
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Maybe I'm still too ingrained with the windows world, but I had thought that most of that (CAD on autodesk, PP with Adobe CC, for example) would have remained in the realm of windows.
Kinda depends entirely on your industry what's big in CAD these days. Revit's got a lot of traction at the structural drafting etc level, inventor's got a bit of market share at the smaller end of the mechanical level...

but at the big scale, huge aerospace projects etc, they arent even in the market. There's a reason so many large-scale projects use CATIA or its like, and most of those products run on linux

Personally I know inventor inside and out, and tend to just boot into windows on the rare occasions I need to cad again. But then, autodesk have that nice thing these days where they give you free software as a student. Benefits of mature age studentdom are few and far between
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Old 2nd July 2017, 9:35 AM   #762
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I downloaded the latest Micro Machines World Series Friday night and have been playing it flat out with my 7yo daughter, runs flawlessly on my Ubuntu MATE based PC. Despite the negative reviews we're both having a blast here! I even went out and bought another controller as my daughter had too much of an advantage being the only one with a controller!

As a retro gaming enthusiast that's been playing the Micro Machines series of games since forever, I think people are being a little harsh with the negative reviews. Relax and enjoy the game, try not to over analyze everything, send feedback to the devs and perhaps in time everything you ask for will be added in the form of updates.

No Man's Sky under Windows, that was crap and worthy of negative reviews. But this game's actually great fun once you give it a go, especially with all the additional game modes. I just want the ability to host a game that I can play over the internet with mates!
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Old 2nd July 2017, 9:57 AM   #763
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Played Grim Dawn last night in wine. Awesome sauce! Another good one in the same genre is Victor Vran which supports linux natively.
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