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Old 13th June 2017, 5:38 PM   #31
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Its better than RX480, has ~2500 stream processors and 40 CU's.

Also don't forget console optimisation. Combined you have a 1070 level performance.
Scorpio:
40 CU's. 64 shaders per CU = 2560 shaders @ 1172mhz, 6 Teraflops.
160 Texture Mapping Units, 48 Render Output Pipelines.


Radeon RX 480:
36 CU's. 2304 shaders @ 1120mhz. (1266mhz boost.) 5.8 Teraflops.
144 Texture Mapping Units, 32 Render Output Pipelines.

Plus you also have bandwidth... Scorpio has 326GB/s the RX 480 has 256GB/s.

Safe to say. Scorpio is faster than the RX 480.

Even the RX 580 with it's higher boosting 1340mhz clock rate (6.17 Teraflops) would also likely still fall short.

Would it match a Geforce 1070? Hell no. That's a good 50% to twice as fast than the RX 480 in most benchmarks, if not more.
But it's faster than the 1060, RX 480.

Plus that "Console Optimization" is countered by the fact the machine is running a shit CPU. And it's RAM is shared. 12GB is for the OS, Drivers, API's, Game, Graphics, Sound, Networking, Background tasks. Everything.

On a decent gaming PC System Ram is 16Gb and GPU's are trending towards 6-8GB for 22GB-24GB combined. I don't care how much optimization you throw around, most decent gaming PC's have roughly twice the memory to play with overall. That makes a difference in the grand scheme of things.
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Old 14th June 2017, 5:13 PM   #32
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I think if they have consoles with this kind of power + native keyboard and mouse support, I would definitely be interested - purely because I could then play games with many friends who play on consoles. I'm saying this as someone who really doesn't like consoles and has played on PC his whole life...

Don't think we'll see native keyboard + mouse support in any shooters on consoles though... there'd be too much backlash from console players getting owned by anyone average or better using keyboard + mouse.
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Old 14th June 2017, 6:07 PM   #33
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LOl I take back everything....guna wait and see how they approach this platform. Apparently Destiny 2 will be capped at 4k 30fps.. one step forward and 2 steps back.
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Old 15th June 2017, 2:58 PM   #34
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LOl I take back everything....guna wait and see how they approach this platform. Apparently Destiny 2 will be capped at 4k 30fps.. one step forward and 2 steps back.
well at the end of the day, it's still a console with more computing power, 6 Teraflops is that great to he honest for 4K 60hz, 1080Ti packing 11.3 Teraflops and it struggling with 4k@60Hz. Obviously the optimisation etc. on consoles will help, but it's not that great to eliminate 5 Teraflops of computing power.

Xbox X will rely on new big titles, meaning "best graphics, best visual experience" these will be all AAA, performance demanding games. Games like these will have to be 4K, 30fps capped.

Thing like some racing sims, FIFA, NHL will most likely run 4K@60fps, everything else will be either upscaled to 4K, capped @ 30fps or the graphic side will get heavily downgraded in the favor of 60fps as this seems to be the new thing.

I still remember the BS, with current console generation "cinematic experience" aka we cannot squeeze 60 frames, let's cap at 30fps and let the marketing department come with some BS for the end customer. Anyone with half a brain (or high refresh rate monitor) had a really good laugh on it.
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Old 18th June 2017, 8:53 PM   #35
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The biggest thing is that game devs can optimise to 1 spec instead of pc which has many.. There will be times games will run better on Xbox one X then a 1070 and beyond and itl suck balls but that's how it is.

Luckily no need for me to buy xbox X as the exclusives I play now all come to pc.

... But I'll still want one.
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Old 19th June 2017, 6:27 AM   #36
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With all this talk of 4K i haven't really seen how and how much it is going to benefit those of us who haven't upgraded to 4K yet. Still happy playing Xbox using my 1080p projector on a 125" screen and don't plan to upgrade to 4k anytime soon.
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Old 19th June 2017, 8:14 AM   #37
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LOl I take back everything....guna wait and see how they approach this platform. Apparently Destiny 2 will be capped at 4k 30fps.. one step forward and 2 steps back.
the machine was always targeting 4K/30 - the CPU can't hope to keep up. And when they hit 60 and 4k it'll be racing games and things like that - everything else will be up-scaled, dynamic res and checkerboard.

The PS4 Pro, and XBX are both FauxK devices.

PC is where the real 4K lives.
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Old 19th June 2017, 10:38 AM   #38
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The biggest thing is that game devs can optimise to 1 spec instead of pc which has many.. There will be times games will run better on Xbox one X then a 1070 and beyond and itl suck balls but that's how it is.

Luckily no need for me to buy xbox X as the exclusives I play now all come to pc.

... But I'll still want one.
In the old days devs would make console specific engines that ran horrible on PC's.

These days performance is about the same with the main benefit developers have on console is being able to tweak the settings to look the best for the hardware.

On PC we only have set video options, we can't tell the game to reduce the render distance because our CPU can't handle it when there's no view distance setting...


4k on the Xbox One X is basically a joke as its technically impossible without reducing graphical settings or cheating on 4k.

If your GPU performs at a certain way at 1080p and you ask it to run in 4k its going to run at a set fps, there is no magic trick to improve performance without reducing quality, like the PS4 Pro 4k.
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Old 19th June 2017, 9:11 PM   #39
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In the old days devs would make console specific engines that ran horrible on PC's.

These days performance is about the same with the main benefit developers have on console is being able to tweak the settings to look the best for the hardware.

On PC we only have set video options, we can't tell the game to reduce the render distance because our CPU can't handle it when there's no view distance setting...


4k on the Xbox One X is basically a joke as its technically impossible without reducing graphical settings or cheating on 4k.

If your GPU performs at a certain way at 1080p and you ask it to run in 4k its going to run at a set fps, there is no magic trick to improve performance without reducing quality, like the PS4 Pro 4k.
I agree with what you are saying but consoles seem to pull some magic off at times, and even though console games are developed in x86 etc there has still been some terrible ports come over current gen.

4k/30fps shouldnt be an issue with the power it has + benefit of 100% optimisation to hardware spec..

4k/60 yeah I struggle to see how games like battlefront II would do that..

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PC is where the real 4K lives.
Well yes, but it aint cheap
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Old 20th June 2017, 7:30 AM   #40
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Well yes, but it aint cheap
not the point
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Old 20th June 2017, 9:28 AM   #41
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Well yes, but it aint cheap
Audi RS6 aint cheap either, but it's on a different level compared to Toyota Corolla
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Old 20th June 2017, 10:14 AM   #42
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I think MS said all first party games are targeting 4K minimum, 60 fps too where possible. Although to be fair they didn't specify if stuff like checker boarding was OK.

Native 4K is better of course, but we have Digital Foundry to figure out if games are cheating or not

Destiny 2 is weird because I don't see any reason it can't do better than 30 fps on the XoneX if the PS4 Pro can do 4K 30 fps...

Anyway... I'm keen for the XoneX... 4K for all my console games, upscaling of all my old Xbox original and Xbox 360 games... sounds good to me
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Old 20th June 2017, 10:19 AM   #43
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I think MS said all first party games are targeting 4K minimum, 60 fps too where possible. Although to be fair they didn't specify if stuff like checker boarding was OK.
they banged on about being "true 4K" in the leadup throwing shade on PS4 Pro for it's trickery to get 4K images.

will it be a great console? probably. will it deliver on what they said? unlikely. does it really matter? kind of.

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Old 20th June 2017, 11:10 AM   #44
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I agree with what you are saying but consoles seem to pull some magic off at times, and even though console games are developed in x86 etc there has still been some terrible ports come over current gen.

4k/30fps shouldnt be an issue with the power it has + benefit of 100% optimisation to hardware spec..

4k/60 yeah I struggle to see how games like battlefront II would do that.
I guarantee you that there are plenty of games it can't handle in real 4k/30fps. I'm not yet aware if they are using fake 4k like the PS4 Pro though.


Also name console optimisation magic that is recent?

Any game using Frostbite, Source, Unity and Unreal engine for example are modern engines built for modern hardware.

The early id Tech 5 engine is a perfect example of a garbage console engine that is built around consoles and does not use PC hardware correctly.


The whole thing is smoke and mirrors really, Crysis 1's maps, models and everything about it was built for PC and the console port was so downgraded it was horrible. In Crysis 2 they created a heavily downgraded world so the game looked better, they disabled a lot of physics for example that were present in Crysis 1 engine just to make a nice game.

Here is a real world example. You create a game, you want to add destructible environments and fancy real time lighting, it works great on PC, but the destructible environments use too much CPU for console and the real time lighting uses too much GPU for console, so you remove destructible environments. On release the PC and console versions look similar and it seems like the game is well optimised, its not. You can't add real time lighting and destructible environments as optional features as these are a huge part of the gameplay.

These days its not so bad, however this whole "4k" thing is just going to create problems. The Xbox One X GPU is suited for 1080p for todays games, that is fact.

The only way around this is through image trickery (PS4 Pro), downgrading games or making what is normally a 60fps game, a 30fps game with reduced visuals to go with it.



If you have an nvidia card you can try it out yourself on your 1080/1440p monitor, add 4k as a custom resolution and select it ingame and see the differences in your games, 4k will obliterate even a 1080ti GPU, the most powerful GPU you can buy today but you can run 4k on an old 290x if you are willing to make compromises...
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Old 20th June 2017, 11:15 AM   #45
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I still think mid-cycle refreshes aren't the worst thing to happen to consoles, however the lowest common denominator will always be base hardware. Unless they allow devs to do exclusives on the big boy machines it's going to be upscales, etc.

I honestly don't think they've really thought out this generationless approach.
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