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Old 10th December 2013, 2:14 PM   #751
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It's a bummer that I'm just realising I won't be playing this much, if what you guys write is true. I've never realised a space-sim is a team-only game. Laugh all you want but that's news for me.

If it's 100% true, it would have been good to know at the outset.

I simply don't have the time nor will to play in teams - I want to lone-wolf things. Maybe I'll just stick to the sp campaign...
it isnt.

there is just as much you can do solo, its just 'different' - being you will be more suited to scouting / espionage and situations where a single ship is less likely to be noticed rather than a whole fleet.

same deal in eve. I must admit I was always upset i never had more people to play with as i wanted to try out the whole fleet thing, but there was plenty i could do by myself.
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Old 10th December 2013, 2:16 PM   #752
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They havent fully released details for combat though. It's just based on what the developers have said in their podcasts on what they're trying to achieve.
The point of pledging is to get involved with the development of the game.

As for space simulator games you shouldn't do them alone. It's far more productive to fly with a squadron / fleet. There should be single player content though i.e. missions or smuggling where one small ship may be less noticeable than a fleet.

For example in Eve Online, a medium sized mining operation could include the following:

* Dedicated ships to strip mine the asteroids.
* Teams of freighters loading your unrefined rocks and taking them back to a refinery or base.
* Teams to escort 1) freighters as they make their way back and forth to your mining operation/base and 2) the mining ships as they plow through the asteroid
* Long range scouts to detect traps/enemy ambush/cloaked ships.
* Logistics/support ships for replenishing capacitors and providing electronic counter measures (if required vs long range missiles/torpedos/point defense).
* Dedicated refinery/manufacturer/researcher (what i did in Eve) to make good use of unrefined ore
* Traders to put stuff on the market and get the best returns on investment

Alternatively, a long range recon/cloaked assault frigate on its own is perfect for espionage or monitoring the location of an enemy carrier. They can relay information back to their home fleet to plan the next ambush.


So back to Star Citizen:

No ship in Star Citizen is going to be able to do everything. Certainly not the single seater ships. You could get by mission running in the RSI Auroras, or exploration of the universe in an Origin 300 if you're that keen to solo - but if the game spawns a small wing of fighters? You probably wouldn't take them yourself and run for it. If you HAD friends with you, you could probably beat the NPCs.

The Constellation is multi-crew vessel and has modular compartments. So you could possibly arm it for space combat, OR use it as hauling vessel, OR equip enough fuel for exploration/recon. You could probably mix two (heavily armed for exploration), but not all three. The Connie is one awesome vessel for a bit of everything but i dont think you will be able to fly it alone. No details have been released on capabilities of AI crew so it's all speculation right now (although i wouldn't be confident that AI crew will be good for anything other than manning guns or turrets).



The game is going to be an awesome player driven universe. You got a lot of time to find some friends to play with


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where did i say anything about solo play?

ok lets scale it up to fleets

a squadron of frigates will decimate a squadron of single seaters

my point still stands completely.

yes but if you read the rest of my post... what's the point of these heavily policed 'safe' zones when it takes forever and a day to actually get anywhere?
I dont even understand what your point is? A squadron of fighters vs squadron of frigates will always lose? You think this is pokemon or tic tac toe?

Your point is that you have no patience for space sims, hallmarks of most games of this genre i.e. Eve Online, X series etc.
In the other thread you became frustrated with Starbound beta because the starter utility "a matter manipulator tool" took too long to farm dirt.
If you only spent a few minutes figuring out how to make a pickaxe... instead of throwing a tantrum and calling the game crap.

As for combat capabilities of fighters and frigates: Have you even played a game with newtonian physics before? Maybe you're used to arcade games where mass doesn't matter.
I would wait till the dog fighting module is released before you make that assessment (again).

I view the heavily policed areas as CONCORD controlled areas of Eve. If someone wants to play PVE only in the high security areas then they're entitled to play without the risk of being ganked by player ships. I dont understand what you mean by "taking forever to get anywhere". You mean you dont want to farm missions for 200 hours to buy a better ship? Then don't play the Star Citizen MMOG. Stick with your private server or Squadron 42.
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Old 10th December 2013, 3:02 PM   #753
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I view the heavily policed areas as CONCORD controlled areas of Eve. If someone wants to play PVE only in the high security areas then they're entitled to play without the risk of being ganked by player ships. I dont understand what you mean by "taking forever to get anywhere".
Let's also not forget the persistent universe is still in the design phase... With a community active design process I'm sure RSI will nut out most problems before the game officially launches, anything up to that point will just be beta problems.

Look at Path of Exile, that game was insanely popular in beta because as a beta game it had more polish than many AAA releases.
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I would. But I would eat the other people before I ran out of supplies, therefore quadrupling my food supply, and allowing me to live for ever, as cannibal king of mars.
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Old 10th December 2013, 3:05 PM   #754
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Oh yeah, the game has a long way to go. The game is probably going to be vastly different in 6-12 months time and we would have to adjust our expectations of the game.

I'm confident that any ships they've designed so far are not going to change (especially if they've already done the animations, sounds and pushed it out to the hangar). The ship specs may change but the appearance of most of the original backed ships are solid. That's the only thing so far i suppose wouldn't change in a year's time.
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Old 10th December 2013, 3:11 PM   #755
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Oh yeah, the game has a long way to go. The game is probably going to be vastly different in 6-12 months time and we would have to adjust our expectations of the game.
Do you watch Wingman's Hangar?

In the latest episode (48) they had Chris Roberts answering some questions, one of them was how their PVP slider worked (http://youtu.be/sq7g0HnsIro?t=30m58s)... Basically it sounds like you can specify whether you want to be in a universe with other people or with AI pilots instead, and the RSI servers will match you with your preference.
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I would. But I would eat the other people before I ran out of supplies, therefore quadrupling my food supply, and allowing me to live for ever, as cannibal king of mars.
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Old 10th December 2013, 3:18 PM   #756
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Can you tell me how multi seated ships work? ie could you spend $500 on a 3 seater ship and then two friends could play for free or the cost of the base game?
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Old 10th December 2013, 3:28 PM   #757
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Can you tell me how multi seated ships work? ie could you spend $500 on a 3 seater ship and then two friends could play for free or the cost of the base game?
I think it's implied your friends would need the base game, but at this stage pricing for Star Citizen with no starter ships hasn't been announced and likely won't be announced until launch. If I were a betting man, I'd say $10-15. $30 would get you the game and an Aurora. $60 would get you SC, an Aurora and the Squadron 42 single player campaign.
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I would. But I would eat the other people before I ran out of supplies, therefore quadrupling my food supply, and allowing me to live for ever, as cannibal king of mars.
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Old 10th December 2013, 5:24 PM   #758
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As for space simulator games you shouldn't do them alone.
I completely disagree ... you cant seriously expect that the developers would make a game that is not enjoyable for most likely majority of ppl who bought into the game so far and will play solo. Lot of ppl who have invested heavily into the game have life and family commitments (I for example spent what I spent as I want those particular ships without grinding for them and want to just jump straight into it and start enjoying the game in the few spare hours I will have). Honestly, how often do you think you will be with enough friends online playing the game at the same time. Or ... how many of your friends actually that bought the game too and are passionate about it are willing to upgrade their hw etc ? You personally might have few but thats not what reality is.

Also, not sure where your info is from but they said on many many occasions that single player is perfectly fine and you can hire NPCs as your wingmen and crewmen. I have ONE friend who bought into the game and I seriously doubt we will have many missions playing together simply as we have different personal life commitments. I am sure that when the moment comes when we both play it will be fun but I struggle to see why would playing solo be any less fun if you commit yourself to the game.

So to anyone out there thinking of joining and only way to play single player, absolutely, you are more than welcome to join and you will definitely have a blast.
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Old 10th December 2013, 6:08 PM   #759
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im am this close to throwing a pile of money at the screen for this. (seriously considering the constellation package).

the only things really holding me back is i need to know more about how the ship will function solo and how latency will affect the game.
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Old 11th December 2013, 12:24 AM   #760
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Also, not sure where your info is from but they said on many many occasions that single player is perfectly fine and you can hire NPCs as your wingmen and crewmen.

I dont think Wingmen will be available because Chris have said that ships must be piloted by a human player.
You will be able to hire NPCs as crewmen to take up turrets/stations within your vessel.

There will also be a point at which they need to decide whether they want the game to be full of ships crewed by NPCs or players. It's going to be an issue since there will be population caps in each instance. If you're exploring a sector with a guild do you bring 50 ships of all sizes with 50 players or do you compact the number of ships down and crew them without NPCs? There's got to be a pro/con for bringing human players as opposed to NPCs i.e. how you split the loot. Plus maybe NPCs cant do certain things (i.e. boarding, navigation, bombing, salvage, piracy, C&C) but will excel at others (i.e. shooting things with your turrets, tractor beam space junk, repelling boarding parties, point defense, repairing the ship).

My retalliator is supposed to have 5 turrets, a console for torpedos/bombs and one for navigation plus the pilot. NPC crew will go in the turrets but i'll still need a human to arm the bombs (or drop them on target) so maybe i can fly my bomber with one human player and up to 5 NPCs. The problem is NPCs cant select targets like a human player would. If the threat was coming from the super hornet, human players would communicate and say "kill that hornet first". NPC will shoot at whatever is closest or in range (probably).

There's also this thread on reddit.

Personally i think it'll be fun to crew someone else's ship. I have access to every multi-crew vessel in the game with the size of the fleet i'll be joining. What fun!
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Old 11th December 2013, 12:29 PM   #761
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Heads up,

Drake and MISC Goliath mousepads are on the store, 600ish and counting down.

Just got a MISC.

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/m...mousepadv2.jpg

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/m...mousepadv2.jpg
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Old 11th December 2013, 12:33 PM   #762
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Heads up,

Drake and MISC Goliath mousepads are on the store, 600ish and counting down.

Just got a MISC.

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/m...mousepadv2.jpg

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/m...mousepadv2.jpg
I'm going to wait for my RSI one to arrive, but I might get the drake for my work desk... My old Dell mousepad has actually warped.
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I would. But I would eat the other people before I ran out of supplies, therefore quadrupling my food supply, and allowing me to live for ever, as cannibal king of mars.
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Old 11th December 2013, 8:28 PM   #763
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I dont even understand what your point is? A squadron of fighters vs squadron of frigates will always lose? You think this is pokemon or tic tac toe?

Your point is that you have no patience for space sims, hallmarks of most games of this genre i.e. Eve Online, X series etc.
In the other thread you became frustrated with Starbound beta because the starter utility "a matter manipulator tool" took too long to farm dirt.
If you only spent a few minutes figuring out how to make a pickaxe... instead of throwing a tantrum and calling the game crap.

As for combat capabilities of fighters and frigates: Have you even played a game with newtonian physics before? Maybe you're used to arcade games where mass doesn't matter.
I would wait till the dog fighting module is released before you make that assessment (again).

I view the heavily policed areas as CONCORD controlled areas of Eve. If someone wants to play PVE only in the high security areas then they're entitled to play without the risk of being ganked by player ships. I dont understand what you mean by "taking forever to get anywhere". You mean you dont want to farm missions for 200 hours to buy a better ship? Then don't play the Star Citizen MMOG. Stick with your private server or Squadron 42.
you have to read all my posts to get it...

i'm saying that it HAS to be difficult to get the bigger ships, as evidenced by their massive real world money pricing... and if the bigger ships won't annihilate the smaller ships, much rage to be had.

I'm not saying i have no patience for space sims?

I **love** eve online, it's my go-to MMO addiction, and even in that, you can get to the larger/rarer ships in a day of smart playing..

and no, you didn't read my post in the star citizen thread well enough either.. i learnt perfectly how to make a pickaxe... i was saying it's not as fun as terraria, and the whole interface and crafting systems are clunky and poorly instructed (it was even hard to work out how to warp to planet!)

you can't pick and choose bits of posts simply to reinforce your argument.

and yes, i've played wing commander and starlancer

you really should just go back and read my concerns about the future of this game as an MMO, as i've posted..

there are certain dirrections this game will have to go, to satisfy both the hardcore players and the less hardcore/new players... from what i've seen of their pricing scheme and releases til today, it's going in a very strange, potentially too hardcore direction.

in eve online, if you farmed safe space missions for 200 hours, you could EASILY have the most massively decked out best fit ship you can buy short of a titan. carrier, faction battleship, doesn't matter, you could have it

and that's not even with REALLY smart playing, or investing the earnings for further earnings.

for $40 for the base ship, and $250 odd for what is really seemingly the next step up... heck, convert that into eve pricing (which i know likely won't really apply, but still), and you have a 250 hour ship alone, let alone items.. and it's not even the best ship?

and if you can get it in a lot less than 250 hours of play... the people who paid $250 to buy them are getting majorly ripped off, and wouldn't be happy?

see where i'm coming from?
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Old 11th December 2013, 8:48 PM   #764
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just noticed there are bugger all pledge spots left (comparatively)

/burns a constellation pledge.

ive had a hard on for this game ever since i heard about it during kickstarter phase.. and im still kicking myself for not pledging then.
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Old 12th December 2013, 7:26 AM   #765
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and if you can get it in a lot less than 250 hours of play... the people who paid $250 to buy them are getting majorly ripped off, and wouldn't be happy?

see where i'm coming from?
Ah, but the fact you're neglecting... Those paying $250 aren't BUYING a ship... They're pledging to the development of the game. They've taken a look at the ship, decided they're happy to pledge that much and done it. Without these big spenders the game would likely not be anywhere near as highly funded as it currently is.

Now if RSI still sells ships after release then we can revisit the cost vs hours argument.
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I would. But I would eat the other people before I ran out of supplies, therefore quadrupling my food supply, and allowing me to live for ever, as cannibal king of mars.
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