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Old 7th December 2016, 12:25 PM   #16
shane41
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Add ga-5ax rev 5.2 & K6-3+ overclocked 600mhz
Epox anything " not 478 "
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There is a group of us that get incredibly erect over such hardware. Maybe post in the retro section?
Haha ...........might be a bit rude that picture.
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Old 7th December 2016, 1:09 PM   #17
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Oh I love this.......you have my attention
You interrupted my reserved post space

Yeah it should be good, you might learn something or I might even post a few things to you along the way, especially if you haven't gone pre-socket 7 yet.

Gotta hit up some Socket 3 and Socket 5 action for those sick DIP switch / jumper position overclocks!

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Gotta have an A Bit BP6 with dual celly's. Might not have been common, but very iconic.
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Add ga-5ax rev 5.2 & K6-3+ overclocked 600mhz
Epox anything " not 478 "
Guys we are still years away from that kind of gear hitting the market

Oh also all the pics are coming... it's not just going to be a wall of text

OH SHIT I forgot to leave space for the laptops/portables... Ah well they'll have to come later anyway. They don't take up so much physical space so they can stay in storage for a while
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Old 7th December 2016, 1:19 PM   #18
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You interrupted my reserved post space
Well it's like a good .com < you can repurchase I don't mind >
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There is a group of us that get incredibly erect over such hardware. Maybe post in the retro section?
Haha ...........might be a bit rude that picture.
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Old 7th December 2016, 1:19 PM   #19
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Suggestions Needed:
- the CMOS battery is dead, and I feel like an idiot, but for the life of me I can't actually find the battery on the motherboard
- most of the 486 rigs I worked on had the 4-pin 2-wire connection off to the battery that would be velcro'd randomly inside the case, but this came before that.
- most of the other 386 boards I've seen had a funny kind of "wavy" cylindrical battery near the keyboard connector, usually well cooked by now. Not on this board. Pics to follow.
The board probably has a Dallas or similar RTC chip with a battery inside it. You can buy replacements or do a battery mod to them.
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Old 7th December 2016, 1:30 PM   #20
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Suggestions Needed:
- did anyone have EGA cards in these? or would they mostly have been mono/CGA?
- what version of DOS was common in this era?
- if you happened to be alive and of an appropriate age when this stuff was first introduced, what games were you playing?
- what kind of bus connection do you call this, for HDDs:

image
1. Very much dependent on when the XT was manufactured. Early IBM/XT Clones your looking at CGA/Mono, later they moved to EGA. With the Atari PC's for example (PC1, PC2, PC3 - all 8088), they were built between 87-89 and all had EGA onboard graphics. However I should point out early released models generally came with EGA mono CRT's, later with EGA colour CRT's.

2. Really difficult to say which DOS was common as the XT's were around since the original IBM XT in the early 80's and finished in the late 80's with the last XT clones. That's quite a few DOS revisions in between! Later clones (which yours would be I assume) would of used MS-DOS 3.21 or 3.30. FYI go with 3.30 as it's generally accepted to be best version to use with XT's as it uses the least conventional memory and is the most reliable. MS-DOS 4 (buggy), MS-DOS 5,6 (RAM hog, has features an 8088 can't use) aren't worth it.

3. First games I played on my Atari PC3 around 1989 were Sopwith, Alley Cat and some more early one's which I'm drawing a mental blank on! May come back to that another time. Later games Test Drive, California Games, Sim City, F15 Strike Eagle, Their Finest Hour (first game I actually owned and still have to this day), Journey, Silent Service, Monkey Island, Loom etc. God damn what an era, some absolute classics there...

4. That's an 8 bit MFM Controller and MFM HDD. The Seagate ST-225 was apparently one of most common and reliable drives around that period. I have one of those drives in my Atari PC2 but on a RLL controller. Good read to explain the differences: MFM and RLL.
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Old 7th December 2016, 2:07 PM   #21
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Great idea sonic, it's frustrating how real life gets in the way of organising the collection sometimes!

Re your PS/2 OS, Wikipedia says

"The OS/2 operating system was announced at the same time as the PS/2 line and was intended to be the primary operating system for models with Intel 286 or later processors. However, at the time of the first shipments, only PC DOS was available. OS/2 1.0 (text-mode only) and Microsoft's Windows 2.0 became available several months later. IBM also released AIX PS/2, a UNIX operating system for PS/2 models with Intel 386 or later processors."

I remember tooling about with OS/2 on a PS/2 when I worked at IBM, but it was quite a slow machine, so it made our Win 3.1 setups seem responsive in comparison. Hopefully you have a sound card in yours, MCA sound cards are worth a fortune!

For your PC/XT, here's some more IBM PCs on sale in Oz, including the sought after 5151 ...

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/2-x-Origi...8AAOSw5cNYQy1m

Pickup only in Qld though
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Old 7th December 2016, 2:20 PM   #22
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That's doable. Plenty of members near Brissie would help out.
Help a man realize his dreams
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There is a group of us that get incredibly erect over such hardware. Maybe post in the retro section?
Haha ...........might be a bit rude that picture.
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Old 7th December 2016, 2:46 PM   #23
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BOOOOOOOOOOM just got this!! http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/192045959469

JidaiGeki you are a dead set legend mate
:thumbup :
- if you're ever down this way I'll sling you a 6-pack or a bottle of whatever poison you choose, or if you're keen on anything I'm selling, I'll give you a significant discount




All that aside (so excited!!!) $300 + courier costs so it's not cheap, but I've been after one for ages. A shame it's not the original monitor. But with so many of the original books and software disks included it's worth it in my book.

Anyone playing at home, I'm not gonna spend anywhere near this much on any other investments for this project - this is a one-off special

Expect to see a bunch of gear listed in the FS section tonight - I'll need to scrape together that $300 I just spent before Christmas for presents for the missus / kids / family etc.

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Originally Posted by shane41 View Post
Well it's like a good .com < you can repurchase I don't mind >
$5 for that spot and that 386 chip

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Originally Posted by Cannula View Post
The board probably has a Dallas or similar RTC chip with a battery inside it. You can buy replacements or do a battery mod to them.
Ah okay - I didn't even realise that was a thing! Thanks for the info

Were these kinds of RTC chips common? And do you know if there is any risk of them corroding and damaging other components if/when they fail?

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Originally Posted by Flamin Joe View Post
1. Very much dependent on when the XT was manufactured. Early IBM/XT Clones your looking at CGA/Mono, later they moved to EGA. With the Atari PC's for example (PC1, PC2, PC3 - all 8088), they were built between 87-89 and all had EGA onboard graphics. However I should point out early released models generally came with EGA mono CRT's, later with EGA colour CRT's.
It certainly was never mono - the original card in it was a CGA but it came with an EGA card in an anti-static bag. The monitor is colour although it's quite curious - it has a button on the side to change between various colour modes.

From memory it can do white/pink/yellow/cyan, or black/green/orange/~~~something. Although I don't think it had any effect with the EGA card, only the CGA card? Still this is going back a long time so I'll have to fire it all up and confirm. I can't even remember which card is in there and I have no chance whatsoever of finding whichever card is not.

I'll try and find a manufacture date on it somewhere, or some other way I can date it (maybe the date modified of some files created just after DOS was installed, pretty sure the OS install is all original)

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2. Really difficult to say which DOS was common as the XT's were around since the original IBM XT in the early 80's and finished in the late 80's with the last XT clones. That's quite a few DOS revisions in between! Later clones (which yours would be I assume) would of used MS-DOS 3.21 or 3.30. FYI go with 3.30 as it's generally accepted to be best version to use with XT's as it uses the least conventional memory and is the most reliable. MS-DOS 4 (buggy), MS-DOS 5,6 (RAM hog, has features an 8088 can't use) aren't worth it.
Yeah I'm pretty sure it has some flavour of DOS 3 on it, for those very reasons. As long as that's era-suitible, I'll just leave it (just wouldn't want to be running a version of DOS released many years after the machine would've been)

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3. First games I played on my Atari PC3 around 1989 were Sopwith, Alley Cat and some more early one's which I'm drawing a mental blank on! May come back to that another time. Later games Test Drive, California Games, Sim City, F15 Strike Eagle, Their Finest Hour (first game I actually owned and still have to this day), Journey, Silent Service, Monkey Island, Loom etc. God damn what an era, some absolute classics there...
Yeah totally agree. Test Drive, Street Rod, California Games, etc, were all top-notch titles (for their day, although I would argue Sim City still is better quality / game design than most of today's releases, still this is not meant to be a retro game discussion thread so I'll leave that go). Although personally Monkey Island and even Test Drive etc I was definitely playing on the 386 or 486 or P1 system. The "XT" was more old school.

Definitely Paganitzu, but also ASCII stuff like Kingdom of Kroz... some other stuff

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Originally Posted by Flamin Joe View Post
4. That's an 8 bit MFM Controller and MFM HDD. The Seagate ST-225 was apparently one of most common and reliable drives around that period. I have one of those drives in my Atari PC2 but on a RLL controller. Good read to explain the differences: MFM and RLL.
Thanks for that - that's actually a really good article

Yeah I have a spare ST-225 + controller in a box in the cupboard, pulled from another XT clone that I chucked out years ago, just in case the one in mine packs up.

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Originally Posted by JidaiGeki View Post
Great idea sonic, it's frustrating how real life gets in the way of organising the collection sometimes!
Totally agree with that - and it's frustrating when people link you to expensive items that you then go and waste all your money on

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Originally Posted by JidaiGeki View Post
Re your PS/2 OS, Wikipedia says

"The OS/2 operating system was announced at the same time as the PS/2 line and was intended to be the primary operating system for models with Intel 286 or later processors. However, at the time of the first shipments, only PC DOS was available. OS/2 1.0 (text-mode only) and Microsoft's Windows 2.0 became available several months later. IBM also released AIX PS/2, a UNIX operating system for PS/2 models with Intel 386 or later processors."

I remember tooling about with OS/2 on a PS/2 when I worked at IBM, but it was quite a slow machine, so it made our Win 3.1 setups seem responsive in comparison. Hopefully you have a sound card in yours, MCA sound cards are worth a fortune!
Yeah I'm pretty sure mine has a 286 in it, and it might even have OS/2 on there. However I sort of got the impression that OS/2 wasn't widely adopted so might not really be representative of what these machines ran day-to-day...

I guess for history's sake I should put OS/2 on there although I kinda like the early Windows versions (going to put up another WTB for any legit retro Windows stuff). I wasn't alive at the time but I feel like Windows didn't really gain significant momentum / widespread market penetration until 3.x?

Wow, you worked at IBM in the "golden era" of PC's? That's quite the thing to have on your resume! I considered their grad program a few years ago but it was basically call centre work so forget it

I don't remember there being a sound card in it but I'll double-check it all over the coming weeks

Quote:
Originally Posted by JidaiGeki View Post
For your PC/XT, here's some more IBM PCs on sale in Oz, including the sought after 5151 ...

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/2-x-Origi...8AAOSw5cNYQy1m

Pickup only in Qld though
Yeah I saw those before I made the offer on the 5150. But with one dead and one not tested, and none of the original software and books like the other one comes with, I decided to do with one "known good" one and have the collectables to accompany it, and just accept the "wrong" monitor (for now), rather than have 2 that may or may not be any good.

I'll chase after a 5151 down the track, but from the pics of the 3 different ones, it also looks like my Model M and Model F keyboards aren't perhaps the right models for the IBM PCs I have, but that's a totally different can of worms that I absolutely don't have the finances to sort out right now

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Originally Posted by shane41 View Post
That's doable. Plenty of members near Brissie would help out.
Help a man realize his dreams
Yeah if I was super keen I might put the call out to see if anyone could help but as above, I'm going to let the "correct" monitor go for now, and I don't have $400 to spend on extra IBM gear just to have spares
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Last edited by Ma Baker; 8th December 2016 at 8:39 AM. Reason: 2 posts merged. Please edit your post
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Old 7th December 2016, 3:17 PM   #24
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$5 for that spot and that 386 chip
You don't have any money left it's also increasing in value.
Quote:
Were these kinds of RTC chips common? And do you know if there is any risk of them corroding and damaging other components if/when they fail?
Plastic sealed units. Battery just wears out

Many legend Retro guys in here, sure they can help if you need it.
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There is a group of us that get incredibly erect over such hardware. Maybe post in the retro section?
Haha ...........might be a bit rude that picture.
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Old 7th December 2016, 3:45 PM   #25
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Totally agree with that - and it's frustrating when people link you to expensive items that you then go and waste all your money on
I know, right?! Damn those tempting eBay auctions for dream items! Will have to apologise to your wife and kids for ruining Christmas hehehe

But seriously, glad to have helped you find that one, getting the software as well as a working PC is a fantastic outcome

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Yeah I'm pretty sure mine has a 286 in it, and it might even have OS/2 on there. However I sort of got the impression that OS/2 wasn't widely adopted so might not really be representative of what these machines ran day-to-day...

I guess for history's sake I should put OS/2 on there although I kinda like the early Windows versions (going to put up another WTB for any legit retro Windows stuff). I wasn't alive at the time but I feel like Windows didn't really gain significant momentum / widespread market penetration until 3.x?

Wow, you worked at IBM in the "golden era" of PC's? That's quite the thing to have on your resume! I considered their grad program a few years ago but it was basically call centre work so forget it

I don't remember there being a sound card in it but I'll double-check it all over the coming weeks
Not quite, I was the maintenance manager for a major IBM Australia site while studying Comp Sci That was in the late 90s, so while most of the business was moving towards decent Thinkpads, for some reason all of the building management staff (who were mainly engineers) were left with older machines that they were slow to update (no budget for it generally, even though IBM manufactured the damn things!). I remember ordering a brand new Intellistation PII for CAD and that was a massive upgrade to our other desktops; my mate who was the resident handyman had the crappiest PS/2 imaginable, and I literally had to scavenge that for him, and set it up in the workshop - he'd turn it on in the morning and then make tea and do a couple of jobs before it finally booted and connected to the Domino server

The best part of that job was having the keys to pretty much the whole building, except for Global Services and the DASD "hall". There used to be decommissioned PS/2s, AS/400s and RS/6000s in underground storerooms, and about 1km of service tunnels to hang out in. Was 100x better than being stuck behind the desk all day. Should have asked for some souvenirs but retro wasn't really a thing for me then ... Anyway, good times
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Old 7th December 2016, 5:13 PM   #26
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Ah okay - I didn't even realise that was a thing! Thanks for the info

Were these kinds of RTC chips common? And do you know if there is any risk of them corroding and damaging other components if/when they fail?
Common in computers up to Pentium Pros, they might be in some boards past socket 8 but none that I can remember.
They don't corrode when they fail (at least there is no record of one failing and causing motherboard damage on the internet that I am aware of) as the power source is contained within the chip itself.

Basically if it's soldered in and you aren't good at soldering, do the mod as it's a lot easier than resoldering a new chip or chip holder after desoldering out the old one. If it's socketed, easy to just order one new.
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Old 7th December 2016, 5:58 PM   #27
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The Family 386

So many memories of gaming on one of these. From Sopwith, Alley Cat, Ultima IV and I think one of the greatest games (ahead) of it's time, Microprose Formula One Grand Prix. All this gaming goodness took place for me on a CGA screen, love that 4 colour goodness LOL.

Thanks for the memories, don't forget to put some or all of those titles on the machine
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Old 7th December 2016, 6:31 PM   #28
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The Family 386

So many memories of gaming on one of these. From Sopwith, Alley Cat, Ultima IV and I think one of the greatest games (ahead) of it's time, Microprose Formula One Grand Prix. All this gaming goodness took place for me on a CGA screen, love that 4 colour goodness LOL.

Thanks for the memories, don't forget to put some or all of those titles on the machine
Despite having EGA graphics, I played a lot of the early games I had in CGA which was fun. Funny thing, I had a dodgy copy of Test Drive which was only in CGA and for a long time I thought that was the norm having never touched it since. Fast forward to now and not too long ago I picked up a copy and what do I find? A disk labeled "EGA" as well as a "CGA" disk. You bastard!!! You mean I could of been playing in glorious EGA all those years ago!!
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Old 7th December 2016, 8:45 PM   #29
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IBM PS/2

Suggestions Needed:
- what OS did these ship with?
IBM PC DOS initially. This was right around the time when Microsoft started doing dodgy things that ultimately ended up in MS DOS reaching popularity. But if you want to be era-accurate, tracking down a version of PC DOS that matches the year of manufacture of the motherboard would be your best bet.

There were a few models that shipped with early builds of OS/2, which could be fun to try and get working. Not a whole lot of entertainment software for OS/2 though (it was all business software), so you'd be booting back to PC DOS to play games.
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Old 7th December 2016, 9:31 PM   #30
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IBM PS/2
....Renaissance Computers in Essendon, cnr of Lincoln Rd and Buckley St, anyone remember it?...
That's just around the corner from where I grew up! I was probably too young then though, I do remember there was some building with a rusted water cart, it was on the south side of that intersection... weird the things I remember!
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