Just a Nintendo 64... or is it?

[vsixtyfour]

Hey Guys,

I'm in the early planning stages of modding an N64 to house a PC which will emulate N64, SNES and NES games. I want to retain a sleeper look, so no I/O shield on the back of the console, the only external connectors should be power out of the power brick, a HDMI port to replace the video out port on the back and the original N64 controller ports on the front.

I am looking to run a streamlined version of windows 7 + Hyperspin for the front end which will load the appropriate Emulators and associated backed up game images I have (for the games I own).


I'm also currently debating the emulators:

NES - For the NES there seems to be a few reliable options around but I think I am leaning towards either Nestopia or FCEUX (as it is more compatible) or bsnes for the reasons below.

SNES - With the Snes it becomes a little more complicated, ZSNES is the defacto standard however there are some issues with certain games as outlined here which is why I am considering bsnes as an alternative. Another great reason to use bsnes is that it not only supports SNES but NES as well.

N64 - Again there are a number of options regarding the 64, I'm currently looking at Project64 and 1964 by the looks of things 1964 hasnt had an update since 2009, where as with Project64 currently has version 1.6 out and an option to donate for version 1.7. I am leaning more towards Project64 at this stage.

I already have the N64 console, I had attempted the melted ballpoint pen screw impression DIY game bit.. (see you tube) but failed miserably lol so I have purchased from ebay the required 4.5mm and 3.8mm "game bits" to crack open the console and cartridges which are due to arrive next week.

In terms of hardware there are a couple of options that I'm looking at.

Intel
I was looking to install an Intel Thin ITX motherboard with a low powered i3 processor, the concern here is that due to the higher more accurate level of emulation that bsnes offers, it requires much more power, 3Ghz is recommended in fact. In such a confined space I fear that this could cause a lot of issues with heat dissipation.

AMD
The alternative was to look at an AMD ITX solution, I was potentially looking to source (if I can find one) an A8-3820 as this has a 65W TDP yet can still push out 6550D ATI(AMD) graphics. The downside is it is clocked at 2.5Ghz and turbos to 2.8 (200Mhz short of the recommended 3Ghz). Anything Higher or newer pushes the thermal envelope to 100W.

In terms of controllers, I will acquire two of the '2 xN64 controller USB adaptors' and integrate these internally to the USB headers on the ITX board.

I am thinking I will end up storing the hard drive inside a cut down(to maintain room inside the n64 enclosure) cartridge.
There are two expansion ports (the memory expansion slot on top of the unit and the EXT. port on the base, I am thinking it would be cool to have an option to plug in something to these.. not sure as yet.

Open to thoughts and suggestions

[Tazor]

Originally Posted by vsixtyfour

Hey Guys,

I'm in the early planning stages of modding an N64 to house a PC which will emulate N64, SNES and NES games. I want to retain a sleeper look, so no I/O shield on the back of the console, the only external connectors should be power out of the power brick, a HDMI port to replace the video out port on the back and the original N64 controller ports on the front.

I am looking to run a streamlined version of windows 7 + Hyperspin for the front end which will load the appropriate Emulators and associated backed up game images I have (for the games I own).


I'm also currently debating the emulators:

NES - For the NES there seems to be a few reliable options around but I think I am leaning towards either Nestopia or FCEUX (as it is more compatible) or bsnes for the reasons below.

SNES - With the Snes it becomes a little more complicated, ZSNES is the defacto standard however there are some issues with certain games as outlined here which is why I am considering bsnes as an alternative. Another great reason to use bsnes is that it not only supports SNES but NES as well.

N64 - Again there are a number of options regarding the 64, I'm currently looking at Project64 and 1964 by the looks of things 1964 hasnt had an update since 2009, where as with Project64 currently has version 1.6 out and an option to donate for version 1.7. I am leaning more towards Project64 at this stage.

I already have the N64 console, I had attempted the melted ballpoint pen screw impression DIY game bit.. (see you tube) but failed miserably lol so I have purchased from ebay the required 4.5mm and 3.8mm "game bits" to crack open the console and cartridges which are due to arrive next week.

In terms of hardware there are a couple of options that I'm looking at.

Intel
I was looking to install an Intel Thin ITX motherboard with a low powered i3 processor, the concern here is that due to the higher more accurate level of emulation that bsnes offers, it requires much more power, 3Ghz is recommended in fact. In such a confined space I fear that this could cause a lot of issues with heat dissipation.

AMD
The alternative was to look at an AMD ITX solution, I was potentially looking to source (if I can find one) an A8-3820 as this has a 65W TDP yet can still push out 6550D ATI(AMD) graphics. The downside is it is clocked at 2.5Ghz and turbos to 2.8 (200Mhz short of the recommended 3Ghz). Anything Higher or newer pushes the thermal envelope to 100W.

In terms of controllers, I will acquire two of the '2 xN64 controller USB adaptors' and integrate these internally to the USB headers on the ITX board.

I am thinking I will end up storing the hard drive inside a cut down(to maintain room inside the n64 enclosure) cartridge.
There are two expansion ports (the memory expansion slot on top of the unit and the EXT. port on the base, I am thinking it would be cool to have an option to plug in something to these.. not sure as yet.

Open to thoughts and suggestions

This is an awesome idea, have you measured the case interior dimensions to ensure a board will fit? Also does core speed make too much of an issue on current components, the A8 is quad core so it would be more than competent running an emulator. Although I'm probably wrong. But love the idea and look forward to seeing some pics when you've started.

[zolokopper]

Nice project. From experience it will be tough to fit it inside the N64, I have done a NES console and that was a tight fight.

For a motherboard you might want to go for Nvidia ION, as the power comes onboard, meaning you only have to plug in a cable into the back of it, you dont need a PSU, saving you space. Obviously go with a 2.5' hard drive.

Good luck.

[Ethan W]

I'd be going with the i3, most definitely. While N64 emulation is not heavy at all and both would do the trick (3GHz is aimed at Pentium 4s, I'd assume) you're better off with a Dual Core unless you start emulating PS2 or Gamecube games. In fact, the i3 has much more grunt per-core. Mhz don't matter.

Secondly, you want a lower TDP, because ventilation is poor. 100W, while it might not reach it, is a LOT of heat to be getting out of that casing. Unless you want fans exhausting, go with the i3.

Secondly, in terms of the HDD, I'd go with a small SSD. The games you're dealing with are all small, so space isn't an issue. The SSD gives you much faster loading times, lower heat output (important if in a game casing) and the ability to move the thing around with fewer concerns. 30-60GB SSDs can be had for under $75, nowdays.

In terms of emulators, PJ64 is great. There are some good plugins available for it, too. Look into the ones that enable high-res texture packs for Zelda, Mario, BanjoKazooie and the like.

Best of luck.

[vsixtyfour]

Thanks for the feedback!

I'm not the first to put an ITX board inside an n64 however the ones I have seen ended up with the I/O shield right at the back of the unit with minimal space at the front. It's going to be very very tight but I think it can be done

Will know more once I decide on the hardwar and do some test fitting.
I also need to figure out how I'm going to mount the board inside the enclosure as I'm probably going to have to dremel away some of the plastic inside.

With regard to the ION board I think the biggest issue is that it will be under powered. I'm looking at either a Pico psu with an external power brick, if I'm clever enough I MIGHT be able to integrate it into the N64 psu.

I do need to acquire a couple of these for testing if anyone has a busted or working n64 power supply I would love to take it off of your hands?

[vsixtyfour]

Ethan, is the IGP on the i3 capable enough to support the 64 graphics requirements? Especially with the texture packs? There seems to be limited information regarding this, I've been looking for a while but cant get a straight answer on the recommended graphics for n64 emu.

[@ce114]

That sounds pretty kick ass.

In regards to the CPU I would have a look at the new Intel i3s. The new IB i3 3225 has the HD4000 graphics which is supposed to be a good bit better than the HD3000 on the SBs with a TDP of 55w. They will probably release some more energy efficient ones eventually too.

[vsixtyfour]

Originally Posted by @ce114

That sounds pretty kick ass.

In regards to the CPU I would have a look at the new Intel i3s. The new IB i3 3225 has the HD4000 graphics which is supposed to be a good bit better than the HD3000 on the SBs with a TDP of 55w. They will probably release some more energy efficient ones eventually too.

I've had a look, there doesn't seem to be any Thin ITX options for Ivy Bridge as yet, so I think I will stick with the Sandy Bridge Intel Board - the DH61AG. It's available for around the $125 mark.

Given that HD4000 graphics will give me the piece of mind for future upgrades I'm now awaiting availability of the i3-3225, I cant find any released pricing as yet only speculative. Strange given they launched on the 23rd of April.. Must be a lot of SB i3's sitting on hand at various resellers right now. Perhaps this will change closer to mid month. In the mean time I'm going to continue to acquire odds and ends for the build.

[Ethan W]

Originally Posted by vsixtyfour

Ethan, is the IGP on the i3 capable enough to support the 64 graphics requirements? Especially with the texture packs? There seems to be limited information regarding this, I've been looking for a while but cant get a straight answer on the recommended graphics for n64 emu.

While it's been a long time, I used to use my Core Duo 1.86GHz/Intel GMA 945 System for N64 Emulation including texture packs and I don't remember it being a problem. Don't hold me to it, but even with the best texture packs, you're looking at 45MB for the lot, so memory isn't an issue on those GPUs.

The main problem with old GPUs, rather than grunt was support of features. The HD2000 on the Sandy Bridge series, while not terribly powerful, has pretty much the same feature set as any DX10 GPU.

If in doubt, go with one of the HD3000 models.

tl;dr - Without texture packs? Definitely. I can't give you an honest answer with, so I won't guess.

[Dex]

I got to get around to a mate's place who has my N64, hopefully still in its original box. Well it was the time I gave it to him. Best of luck with the project

[Joehax]

How about finding a dead 64DD to give you more breathing room with the build?

It'll look über, and provide a bit more room to work with.

[vsixtyfour]

Cheers Dex

Originally Posted by Joehax

How about finding a dead 64DD to give you more breathing room with the build?

It'll look über, and provide a bit more room to work with.

I think that's part of the attraction to the project, the challenge of cramming it all in in such a tight space. No doubt that It would look cool but I want to keep it as original looking as possible

I placed an order today for 2 x dual n64 to USB adapters which I will be stripping back and installing the circuitboards inside the console.

I'm still awaiting the game bits to crack the console. The package is still in transit.. Currently in Florida

[Vuman619]

This project sounds awesome, i can't wait to see the progression.

[dmandn]

Maybe an asus e45m1-i deluxe itx board? I have one and its playing n64 games very well. Little slow on ps2 but was expected.

Also, are you looking at project64, or project64k.....I think project64k is a mod of project64, has different version numbers and gives a rom list at startup. ....I could be wrong though. Maybe someone else can confirm or deny?

[Flohrie]

Awesome, looking to do the exact same project in the near future.

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