Knives? What do you use?

[J-C90]

Originally Posted by Shepete

Could someone enlighten me on what would be a good Japanese Carving knife.
Something that is very sharp, but has a thin blade. I won't be carving near bone. Ostensibly I want something that will allow me to carve very thin slices of beef. A "cook"s" knife just doesn't "cut it". (Pun intended.)
I am afraid I don't understand the Japanese terminology.

Yanagi's are best for very fine slicing, they are mainly used for fine slices of fish for sashimi. They are a single bevel knife so are a bit delicate and there's a knack to sharpening them.



You would probably be best with a Sujihiki, which is a double bevel blade and closer in style to western carving knife. How much do you want to spend?

[Shepete]

Originally Posted by caspian

I suspect you'll find that the knife is less of a factor than your own knife skills.

I realise you didn't mean that as an insult, but I suspect I have been weilding a blade since before you were born.

Originally Posted by Yamunsa

as a rule of thumb some follow the route that most german steel is hard and japanese is soft meaning - germans don't need sharpening alot but when you do it's hard work. japanese need a fair amount of love often but your not going to lose more than 2 mins to lick it in to shape.

)

Oddly enough I was under the distinct impression that exactly the opposite was true. Japanese blades were considerably harder than German.

Originally Posted by J-C90

You would probably be best with a Sujihiki, which is a double bevel blade and closer in style to western carving knife. How much do you want to spend?

Thank you. That was the advice I was after. Indeed the Sujihiki looks to be exactly what I am after. And when I said thin slices I meant about a third the thickness of the slices in your picture.
Any Idea if the Tojiro series Sujihiki are any good. I don't mind spending a bit, but I wouldn't want to go over $200.
Thanks again

[Yamunsa]

Originally Posted by Shepete

Oddly enough I was under the distinct impression that exactly the opposite was true. Japanese blades were considerably harder than German.

absolutly, with broad brush statments like mine it is easy to find something that breaks the rule. however for two pieces under $200, (a chef and utility), i think the op will find it to be accurate if shopping at the likes of king of knives or any general catering supply depot.

(made a guess that the op might favor a cut on the push rather than draw. with a western style blade required the german hard / jap soft tends to be even more firm).

[anark1]

the set i have is below.

http://www.kingofknives.com/Cutlery/...Block-Set.aspx


*RAN Micarta 6pce Knife Block Set*

love them to bits, best knives i have owned.

[J-C90]

Originally Posted by Shepete

Thank you. That was the advice I was after. Indeed the Sujihiki looks to be exactly what I am after. And when I said thin slices I meant about a third the thickness of the slices in your picture.
Any Idea if the Tojiro series Sujihiki are any good. I don't mind spending a bit, but I wouldn't want to go over $200.
Thanks again

Yeah that was for a stir fry - didnt want to go too thin! Its more about the ease of slicing. The idea with a Yanagi is you dont need to saw through soft proteins, just one long pulling motion to get a nice clean slice. Thats where length of the knife comes into play as well.

I'm a fan of the Tojiro. The DP series are a no nonsense good quality Japanese knife for a good price. I've used this seller on Ebay a couple of times and had good experiences:

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Japanese-...item5893d859a1

You can spend more, but unless you really know what you want as far as type of blade steel, knife profile or specific maker etc. then you can't really go wrong with a Tojiro DP.

[Shepete]

Thanks for the help J-C90. I just ordered the 270mm Tojiro

[broccoli]

Originally Posted by stenchlord

I'll continue to look up different sets etc but if I haven't found anything by next week I'll likely throw them an order and a pile of money.

That set's got everything you'll need. The only thing I'd suggest is to go into an actual shop and pick up the knives and make sure you are happy with how they feel. It'd be a shame to get a full set of something that you aren't comfortable with.

[J-C90]

Originally Posted by Shepete

Thanks for the help J-C90. I just ordered the 270mm Tojiro

Good choice. Now you need some stones and learn to sharpen

I have this:



Takeda 275mm 'Yanagiba' in Aogami Super Steel. They list it as a Yanagi but its actually more a Sujihiki. This thing is a razor! But very thin and delicate, most of the time I am too scared to use it so resort to either one of my Gyuto's or the Yanagi pictured earlier.

[Amfibius]

Originally Posted by Shepete

Oddly enough I was under the distinct impression that exactly the opposite was true. Japanese blades were considerably harder than German.

Yeah that's what I thought too. But then someone else in this thread said that Japanese knives vary in hardness depending on the maker.

[Shepete]

Originally Posted by Amfibius

Yeah that's what I thought too. But then someone else in this thread said that Japanese knives vary in hardness depending on the maker.

I am not convinced that everything I read on the internet is true.

[kangathekat]

no love for ceramics?

i have a A 5.5” Santoku and a 4.5” utility knife from

http://kyoceraadvancedceramics.com/

love them for my everyday use.

still need a new metal knife for carving and heavy meats etc though.

[J-C90]

Originally Posted by Shepete

I am not convinced that everything I read on the internet is true.

Japanese knife makers generally list the hardness of the blade using HRC (Rockwell Hardness). Typically Japanese knives use a harder steel than Western knife makers, which is why you see so many laminated blades, where a hard steel is used for the blade edge sandwiched between a softer more resiliant steel to add durability and strength. Hard steels tend to be more brittle so chip and break easier.

Taken from here: http://www.chefsarmoury.com/about-ja...s/info_13.html

Your typical German knife has a hardness rating of HRC 52 – HRC 56 whereas your typical Japanese knife has a hardness ranging from HRC 58 – 65. The harder the steel and the better quality steel, the longer the edge remains sharp.

This is my Yoshikane Gyuto which uses SKD tool steel:





SKD tool steel was originally formulated for metal cutting applications! It comes in at about HRC 64.

[Shepete]

Yeah I know. It was the other bloke I was referring to.

[caspian]

Originally Posted by Shepete

I realise you didn't mean that as an insult, but I suspect I have been weilding a blade since before you were born.

pretty sure you have not actually, and my point of view has been formed after considerable time spent in various commercial kitchens over the years.

[Yamunsa]

Originally Posted by Shepete

Yeah I know. It was the other bloke I was referring to.

sigh* shrugs

refer to the op.

Originally Posted by stenchlord

In terms of budget... I'd like to keep it under $200 if it's just for the chef's knife and utility

talking about show ponys and not something the op can purchase, within the stated budget, then i agree with you. for the off the shelf, easily available, set of knives the rule of thumb will be german harder and japanese softer.

pressing on with the op's decision to look at the wusthof-classic range i cannot help but underline the assertion that the op may wish for a european style blade. gyutos or light debas are close but still a little off the mark. nice looking picture though

i'd suggest the other factor to remember is the angle of edge. the wusthof's angle being flatter than a shuns mean the german will take abuse far better and require less sharpening... much metter for someone who loves to cook but admits he's just an amateur.

i pulled my work roll from the car this evening to take a shot. sry it's not as good a pic as jc's.



holden & ford, amd & nv, german vs japanese.. always comes down to epeen lol.