[EvE] EVE Online

[giles666]

Hey

I haven't played EVE for months but got a 'free week' email from CCP to sample Quantum Rise and am obviously getting hooked again, dammit.

First port of call is getting my head around teh market again so I can make some isk. WTF is Trite doing at over 4 a unit!!!

[RnR]

T3 info from EON. Source is this thread (page 4) from scrapheap...

http://scrapheap-challenge.com/viewtopic.php?t=22621

- 12,500 possible configurations.
- Five ship components needed. Propulsion, three mid sections (offence, defence, power core) and a sensor array (bridge type thing).
- Each section determines separate abilities. Propulsion for speed, probably offence module for weaponry, etc, etc. Not been fully decided at time of writing.
- The combination of the modules decides the overall stats of the ship.
- Each section requires different skills (loltimesink).
- It would appear that the power core decides what other hull modules you can fit, so you can't have a nano-ewar ship with a billion guns. I might be reading that wrong though.
- Alternatively CCP might introduce some kind of "heat" that allows you to overload the structure of your ships to get this kind of power from one, but only for a very limited time (might just be wild imaginings of the writer though).
- They have been thinking up ways to make sure that Tech III is very much an option, not a requirement. Will they succeed?
- You can disassemble an assembled Tech III ship. Probably useful for transporting at least. Example given is needing your ship to be faster so getting your transport guys to bring down faster components, which will be much smaller and easier to carry, instead of a load of new Tech II ships.
- Rigs: Probably only one, and will make it harder to disassemble the ship because obviously the rig will break. No mention of actual Tech III rigs so far though.
- 'winsauce'. Not entirely sure what this is. There is an implication that disassembling a ship might make it lose something. Talk about crew members or a ship being 'sentient' and thus maybe gaining 'experience' or somesuch that is lost when it's broken down. Whatever it is, it's talk of a ship learning and becoming better through some system. Not confirmed and at this point probably going to remain on the drawing board because of balance issues. It could stay there, or it could come in later.
- A little box to the side suggests that as well as what was previously said about trying to not make older ships obsolete, Tech III should hopefully not need a ridiculous amount of time to train, at least initially. Breadth > Depth in the skill department here.
- Apparently not a lot of coding issues so far. An original prototype was thrown together by the CTO while waiting to do his FanFest presentation (cocky bastard).
- Base chassis might get a name but the likelihood is that CCP aren't going to be insane enough to come up with names for all variations. Not really sure how this is going to work though. They might just use the component type names stuck together, creating "Hunter-Squirrel XE-4". Implication here that we get to name what we create.
- Tech I = multi-purpose. Tech II = specialisation. Tech III = Tech I + Tech II; a ship that can fill any role you want, but only one at a time.
- Covert Ops pilots should either cry or rejoice. You're going to need to get good at spotting subsystems and knowing what they do. 'Look At' might become popular, although pretty painful in a large group of Tech III ships.
- You won't be able to tell a ships role/subsystems from scanner results.
- Subsystem targeting is still an idea (as it has always been) but at the moment it seems they haven't decided to put it in because of balance issues etc. Probably not going in then.
- Only cruiser sized Tech III ships. No idea when Tech III modules will come out. Any other ships released in the expansion will be related to "True Exploration".

[Hohne]

Originally Posted by giles666

Hey

I haven't played EVE for months but got a 'free week' email from CCP to sample Quantum Rise and am obviously getting hooked again, dammit.

First port of call is getting my head around teh market again so I can make some isk. WTF is Trite doing at over 4 a unit!!!

Yeah, it's above pyerite. I can only assume it has a large amount to do with the Orca, I've been chewing about half a bil trit per week, because the margin is still fairly good, rather surprisingly, this far along.

Everything above pyerite has come down, nocxium, zydrine & morphite particularly. Probably because it has to with the trit going to other things. Orca's don't take much nocxium or zydrine.

o/ Giles, welcome back

[B5lurker]

Originally Posted by Hohne

Yeah, it's above pyerite. I can only assume it has a large amount to do with the Orca, I've been chewing about half a bil trit per week, because the margin is still fairly good, rather surprisingly, this far along.

Almost makes one consider going Macro

[Thunder]

I've been playing for about 2 weeks now, I've sorta got mixed feelings about the skills system. It's good that if you're not able to play for a week or more you can just train a rank V skill and leave it, but at the same time I've found myself being able to get the money for the next ship before I'm ready to train the skill for it.

On the whole I'm liking it so far, although I find training the learning skills a little irritating. It's gonna take me a bit over a week to get the learning & adv learning skills both to rank IV then I'll start training battlecruiser and the ancillary skills needed to fly it properly.

From what I can tell, it's not really worth the effort to train the learning skills to rank V, at least not in the short term. Can any experienced players comment on this? I've checked out the eve forums and this seems to be the general consensus, although the discussion degenerated into a shitfight.

[cirion]

Originally Posted by Thunder

I've been playing for about 2 weeks now, I've sorta got mixed feelings about the skills system. It's good that if you're not able to play for a week or more you can just train a rank V skill and leave it, but at the same time I've found myself being able to get the money for the next ship before I'm ready to train the skill for it.

I share the same kinda thoughts on the skill system. That balance point you bring up is very valid imo

[godkilla]

Originally Posted by Thunder

I've been playing for about 2 weeks now, I've sorta got mixed feelings about the skills system. It's good that if you're not able to play for a week or more you can just train a rank V skill and leave it, but at the same time I've found myself being able to get the money for the next ship before I'm ready to train the skill for it.

On the whole I'm liking it so far, although I find training the learning skills a little irritating. It's gonna take me a bit over a week to get the learning & adv learning skills both to rank IV then I'll start training battlecruiser and the ancillary skills needed to fly it properly.

From what I can tell, it's not really worth the effort to train the learning skills to rank V, at least not in the short term. Can any experienced players comment on this? I've checked out the eve forums and this seems to be the general consensus, although the discussion degenerated into a shitfight.

If it makes you feel any better, it used to be a lot worse than it is now. You used to have to do the basic ones to V before you could start advanced, which meant it was about a month or so before you can get in to the skills that are actually interesting.

My advice would be to train the basics up to 3 (or 4 + a couple of levels of advanced for perception + will) then train enough guns and ship skills to keep you entertained for a while. Once you've got the skills to fly a cruiser or possible even a BC reasonably well then go back and train the learning skills up to IV/III, aiming to get to V/IV within the first 6 months or so.

Its pretty much never worth training the advanced one to V as the payoff time is far too long to be worth bothering with. Implants are something you should look in to, as it doesn't take long to train cybernetics so its a good way to accelerate your training by buying some cheap implants.

[Bracken_02]

Originally Posted by Thunder

From what I can tell, it's not really worth the effort to train the learning skills to rank V, at least not in the short term. Can any experienced players comment on this? I've checked out the eve forums and this seems to be the general consensus, although the discussion degenerated into a shitfight.

The basic learnings payoff quite quickly in getting them from IV to V. It's only about 4days-something to train each, which isn't really that much.

Advanced learnings to V however takes a long, long, long, long, time to pay off. For me, and i'm a pretty well rounded character skill goal wise, it's about 450-500 days before i start being in the green. Advanced to IV is very much worth it, about 2 days each and pays off in around 40-80 days depending on the attribute. Charisma isn't nearly as important though remember.

Basically the best advice you will get is:
- In the very short term, train basics to IV and advanced to III.
- Going out for the weekend??? Set an advanced to IV (this only takes 2daysish so do advanced to IV first), or a basic to train to V.
- Going out for a couple weeks? Train cybernetics to V. For the same time as one adv.learning to V, you get access to +5 implants, so that's an extra point in ALL attributes once you have the cash, and it doesn't take all that long really. Of course if you pvp a lot this may not be that appealing, though even then you can have a +5 equipped clone-body in a safe area while you carebear it up.
-Already trained Cybernetics to V, and going out again for a few weeks? Set one of the adv. learnings to V. You can tell which will give you the most gain by setting up a massive skill plan (something in the range of 1-2 years worth), and hitting 'implant calculator' and seeing which attribute shaves off the most time per +1. Note as i said the payoff time is still incredibly long, so personally i wouldn't bother if you also had a long skill to train like Battleship V.
- On the whole, you'd be well advised to not priority any learning to V if you really have more important stuff to train for. Save it for weekends and holidays and you'll have a much better time. Once you've trained 4/3 normal/adv. you're training significantly faster, and not all that much slower than 5/4.

[Thunder]

Cool, I'll do that. Cheers for the advice.

Learning skills seem to be a bit of a stupid idea, It's like one of those things serves no purpose, yet you need to do it.

[gumble85]

Originally Posted by Thunder

Cool, I'll do that. Cheers for the advice.

Learning skills seem to be a bit of a stupid idea, It's like one of those things serves no purpose, yet you need to do it.

Serves no purpose? WTF are you smoking? If it weren't for learning skills it would take at least double the time to train anything. Geez! For example. My alt that i plan to sell is training up his learning skills atm and i will gain up to 140-165 days worth of train just on gallente battleship alone. If i didn't train the learning skills it would take him 250-300 days to get into a domi or mega or hyperion which ever i selected. Now it will take him around 150 days.

I do agree about once your learning skills are fairly high you can get yourself into a suitable ship and work well in it for pvp or pve or whatever and then continue learning skills, but that do serve a huge purpose. Yes they are a pain, but they are worth it big time.

[Thunder]

Originally Posted by gumble85

Serves no purpose? WTF are you smoking?

You misunderstand me.

Everyone may as well start off with those skills or the game mechanics should be adjusted so they are not required and the skills dropped, since you HAVE to train them anyway.

[gumble85]

Originally Posted by Thunder

You misunderstand me.

Everyone may as well start off with those skills or the game mechanics should be adjusted so they are not required and the skills dropped, since you HAVE to train them anyway.

Sorry for that. A brick in a wall has my name on it excuse me for a few minutes.

[Thunder]

Originally Posted by gumble85

Sorry for that. A brick in a wall has my name on it excuse me for a few minutes.

Lol, it's my fault, I didn't do a great job of making my meaning clear.

But yeah, I just think having to train those skills is a broken game mechanic, as they are pretty much mandatory.

[gumble85]

Originally Posted by Thunder

Lol, it's my fault, I didn't do a great job of making my meaning clear.

But yeah, I just think having to train those skills is a broken game mechanic, as they are pretty much mandatory.

I see your point now. The thing is. When i started my new alt i had Spatial Awareness lvl 4 and learning lvl 2. That was the way my learning skills were when i first created him. I could of had more learning skills, but i wanted him to have more military skills. So hence why i have those two when i first finished creating him.

[Hohne]

Ah, having the isk to fly a ship before you're ready, it's a good indication of the amount of inflation in the game, even though ships themselves are also deflating. When I started it took a few weeks to get the isk for a cruiser, and many months to get the isk for a BS. (there were no destroyers or battlecruisers then, the best mining ship was the Apocalypse battleship !)

Learning skills, I would do basics to level 4, and advanced to level 3, and then maybe advanced to level 4 once you have got enough skills to keep you interested. Then once you're starting to think you're ok with the skills you have for a while, do the basics to level 5. I wouldn't bother with these until you at least have a couple ships you like flying, because there's no point in training for the long term optimal situation if you get bored and quit.

Implants train cybernetics to 1 (only need level 1 for +3 implants), and get a set of +3 implants. Down the track get some +4's. You may not want to get +5's for quite a while, at least if you plan on being involved in any PvP, and then if you do you might want a jump clone first.

I wouldn't train the advanced skils to level 5 at all, and if you did only the one you think you will use the most. The payoff is so long that I don't think it is worth having faster training in that long, in exchange for having to wait that much longer for another skill you want.

It doesn't become a big deal after a while, I mean, I know in a month I'll be able to fly a new ship pretty well, but since I already have an absolute heap of ships to choose from, what is one more. Many people do get the second account so they can train another path and get more content quicker, also you can train the second account on learning skills right away since you have one that you can use to 'do' things while it is doing that.