Dolby Digital Live questions

garry · 2nd October 2009, 12:30 PM

Hi just wondering if someone could explain to me how Dolby Digital Live works,I just bought one of those X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty sound cards,having always used onboard sound like I did with all my previous motherboards,owning a sound card now seems to be not as clear cut as the onboard sound used to be,like before with the onboard sound I had the sound output from the optical out of the back of the motherboard and go to my Dolby 5.1 amp,and that worked great,if I played an avi file that had 5.1 sound then I could just send the 5.1 direct from the SPDIF to my amp which would be true 5.1,and if the avi file was only 2 channel then it would only send stereo sound to my amp.

But with this Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty sound card if I enable the Dolby Digital Live it just sends everything to my amp as 5.1,I mean I don't think I am getting the true Dolby Digital Live 5.1 it's like a fake encode,like for example if I play a avi movie with 5.1 sound it will play the movie as 5.1,but I can also go and play an avi movie that only has 2 chanel stereo or even mono,and the Sound Blaster sound card will send it to my amp as a Dolby 5.1 signal,but that's not true 5.1.

How do I know if I am getting the true 5.1 sound,even with a avi file with proper Dolby 5.1,I feel like the sound card is just re encoding everything to 5 channel stereo or something.

I have to admit things were more simpler when I had onboard sound running through the SPDIF.

thaFunkster · 2nd October 2009, 3:59 PM

I wouldnt worry.

I was running a Creative Audigy 2 ZS before, now I have just upgraded to an ASUS Xonar DX, and both cards were doing what you were saying.

The issue is this:

If you are playing 5.1 content, then the soundcard will be sending out true 5.1 content.

But when you play stereo content, the soundcard mixes the stereo content into 5.1, using Dolby Digital Prologic II probably (this is the most common format for doing so.).

However, the issue, when playing Live content in 5.1 is whether the soundcard is sending digital content to your amp to be decoded, or whether the soundcard is decoding the content itself and then sending an analogue 5.1 signal to the amp.

If you only have one SPDIF / coaxiale cable connected from your soundcard to the amp, then all should be fine. But if you have analogue cords connected, then I would be changing the setting on your soundcard to SPDIF passthrough.

Also, if you only want stereo content when listening to stereo, then you will find that setting on your soundcard menu somewhere. Disable Pro-LogicII and you should be right.

(Personally, I like having stereo mixed into 5.1 channels).

garry · 2nd October 2009, 5:49 PM

Thanks for explaining that mate,yeah I only have one SPDIF connected from my sound card to my amp,see my denon 5.1 amp has this mode called 5 channel stereo where it will play any 2 channel or mono signal through all 5 speakers,you know and that's what I was thinking this Dolby Digital Live must of been doing,just re encoding everything to 5 channel stereo just like that setting on my amp.

I don't mind if it does that with games and 2 channel or mono stuff,but I was worried it was re encoding retail encoded 5.1 Dolby Digital streams you would get from a retail dvd movie or a avi movie with a full Dolby 5.1 track into plain 5 channel stereo.

So if I get an avi movie file with a proper encoded 5.1 Dolby track in it,all I need to do is play it with say vlc player and then the Dolby Digital Live will pass the original 5.1 stream untouched to my amp,is that how it works.

I was trying to find a Dolby Digital 5.1 test sound file of the net before to see if it is getting to my amp properly,some sought of test where it would play it to each speaker separately.

garry · 2nd October 2009, 6:16 PM

I just downloaded this dolby digital 5.1 sound video test 15MB,and it worked perfect I played it through vlc player and the sound went to my amp as it should of,each sound only played to the right speaker,but for some reason I can't get either windows media player or media player classic to get any sound from the file.

Just wondering if someone else could try this file with media player classic or windows media player and see if they get 5.1 sound with it.
http://ac3test.blogcu.com/entry.php?...1ch-sound-test

This is a direct link to test 1 http://www.2shared.com/file/3485491/...nd_Test-1.html

At least I can say that 5.1 is definitely getting to my amp with this test,but I would like to get it working with media player classic if possible.

Actually I managed to get media player classic and media player working,I went into the options and had to choose the right sound device,I didn't realize I had to do that because my previous onboard sound worked straight of without needing to change options,so all in fine now.
Thanks.

thaFunkster · 2nd October 2009, 7:54 PM

Good to hear it is all sorted.

U can always disable that 5.1 upmixing in Dolby Pro Logic II on your soundcard if U like, and have it done through your Denon amp ( which would be better quality).

But personally, I find it is easier to have all your setting as u want them on the soundcard and then you dont have to touch a thing on your amp except volume.

I recommend you read through all the documenation that came with the sound card, there may be all kinds of things going on that you want to change.

(Personally I am doing this, trying to get my setup to work properly, but the speakers have just been shipped back, less than a month after they arrived, hopefully next pair will be better), still had to fork out $60 for a damn courier though.

garry · 3rd October 2009, 2:57 AM

Thanks yeah I tried to look for a 5.1 upmixing option on my sound card options buy couldn't see any mention of that option,unless creative call it something else,but like you said I think it is time I got the manual out and read up about everything the card does.

The old onboard sound is so simple compared to these sound cards I think I would of been happy to stick with the onboard,I got the card now so I will try to set it up the best I can.

Anyway thanks again for your help mate,sounds like your having trouble aswell,what was the problem with the speakers were they faulty and needed rmaing.

thaFunkster · 3rd October 2009, 7:01 AM

Yeah the speakers were faulty, I coulnt get it to recognise any digital input, but I think the amp/control centre that came with them was broken. The rear channel totally died.

I will be getting a replacement soon from the retailer.

But actually I wasnt that impressed with the sound. These are the logitech Z-5500, they are the top of the range from logitech, and almost the highest end computer speakers that you can buy, and I was really expecting a better sound than I have heard so far (especially when coupled with a good sound card like I bought). But maybe they will sound better when the replacement arrives.

About your soundcard, from memory, its called CMSS - Creative Multi Speaker Surround, should have remembered that before.

O, and that is a decent soundcard, when you have it set up, it should be good. You should be able to turn it up about twice as loud without distortion over onboard, and the quality should be a lot better.

garry · 4th October 2009, 1:15 AM

Yeah sounds like you had a bit of bad luck there,least the replacements are on the ways I spose,Yeah I have never really got into pc speakers much I have always just plugged the pc into my denon surround amp with the b&w speakers,they sound pretty good,one of my friends bought a $65 pair of logitch speakers the other day and they sound like an old radio heh,but I spose you can't expect much for $65 anyway,your speaker setup would sound a 100 times better than the $65 jobs anyway.

Like you said the replacements might end up better,what ever fault they had might of been causing sound problems aswell,hopefully that was the case.

CMSS thanks I just seen that option,yeah it's just going to take some time I have realized to get this card setup the way I want,now I just found out that the new Red Faction Guerrilla game has real problems with this sound card so I got to wait for a patch before I play it,I was playing that game with my onboard sound a couple days before I bought that sound card without any problems at all,I just installed it today and found out it's got real problems,at least violation knows about it and are working on a patch http://community.redfaction.com/forums/topic/6551

Anyway thanks again for your help mate.

thaFunkster · 4th October 2009, 10:17 AM

No probs at all.

Last thing, you know you can always disable, the sound card and re-enable onboard until the patch comes out....

garry · 4th October 2009, 7:11 PM

Yeah I spose that's an idea,I would have to probably physically unplug the card,I am not sure if you can disable it in windows,I might even do that and play the game for a week or so till I finish it and then plug it back in again.
Funny thing is I never had these sought of problems with the onboard.

thaFunkster · 4th October 2009, 8:30 PM

Yeah well with onboard its all integrated, so its all set up to work nice and easy.

When you upgrade it always gets more complicated, but then the plus is you have more options for how you want to configure your system.

What version of Windows are u running?

You dont need to unplug them. Just go to control panel, right click on your soundcard, and choose "disable this device", then go to onboard right click and select "make default device".

That should do it.

2nd October 2009, 12:30 PM	#1
garry Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Port Kennedy 6172 WA Posts: 2,362	Dolby Digital Live questions Hi just wondering if someone could explain to me how Dolby Digital Live works,I just bought one of those X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty sound cards,having always used onboard sound like I did with all my previous motherboards,owning a sound card now seems to be not as clear cut as the onboard sound used to be,like before with the onboard sound I had the sound output from the optical out of the back of the motherboard and go to my Dolby 5.1 amp,and that worked great,if I played an avi file that had 5.1 sound then I could just send the 5.1 direct from the SPDIF to my amp which would be true 5.1,and if the avi file was only 2 channel then it would only send stereo sound to my amp. But with this Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty sound card if I enable the Dolby Digital Live it just sends everything to my amp as 5.1,I mean I don't think I am getting the true Dolby Digital Live 5.1 it's like a fake encode,like for example if I play a avi movie with 5.1 sound it will play the movie as 5.1,but I can also go and play an avi movie that only has 2 chanel stereo or even mono,and the Sound Blaster sound card will send it to my amp as a Dolby 5.1 signal,but that's not true 5.1. How do I know if I am getting the true 5.1 sound,even with a avi file with proper Dolby 5.1,I feel like the sound card is just re encoding everything to 5 channel stereo or something. I have to admit things were more simpler when I had onboard sound running through the SPDIF.

2nd October 2009, 6:16 PM	#4
garry Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Port Kennedy 6172 WA Posts: 2,362	I just downloaded this dolby digital 5.1 sound video test 15MB,and it worked perfect I played it through vlc player and the sound went to my amp as it should of,each sound only played to the right speaker,but for some reason I can't get either windows media player or media player classic to get any sound from the file. Just wondering if someone else could try this file with media player classic or windows media player and see if they get 5.1 sound with it. http://ac3test.blogcu.com/entry.php?...1ch-sound-test This is a direct link to test 1 http://www.2shared.com/file/3485491/...nd_Test-1.html At least I can say that 5.1 is definitely getting to my amp with this test,but I would like to get it working with media player classic if possible. Actually I managed to get media player classic and media player working,I went into the options and had to choose the right sound device,I didn't realize I had to do that because my previous onboard sound worked straight of without needing to change options,so all in fine now. Thanks. Last edited by garry; 2nd October 2009 at 6:40 PM.

2nd October 2009, 3:59 PM	#2
thaFunkster Awaiting Email Confirmation Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 441	I wouldnt worry. I was running a Creative Audigy 2 ZS before, now I have just upgraded to an ASUS Xonar DX, and both cards were doing what you were saying. The issue is this: If you are playing 5.1 content, then the soundcard will be sending out true 5.1 content. But when you play stereo content, the soundcard mixes the stereo content into 5.1, using Dolby Digital Prologic II probably (this is the most common format for doing so.). However, the issue, when playing Live content in 5.1 is whether the soundcard is sending digital content to your amp to be decoded, or whether the soundcard is decoding the content itself and then sending an analogue 5.1 signal to the amp. If you only have one SPDIF / coaxiale cable connected from your soundcard to the amp, then all should be fine. But if you have analogue cords connected, then I would be changing the setting on your soundcard to SPDIF passthrough. Also, if you only want stereo content when listening to stereo, then you will find that setting on your soundcard menu somewhere. Disable Pro-LogicII and you should be right. (Personally, I like having stereo mixed into 5.1 channels).

2nd October 2009, 5:49 PM	#3
garry Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Port Kennedy 6172 WA Posts: 2,362	Thanks for explaining that mate,yeah I only have one SPDIF connected from my sound card to my amp,see my denon 5.1 amp has this mode called 5 channel stereo where it will play any 2 channel or mono signal through all 5 speakers,you know and that's what I was thinking this Dolby Digital Live must of been doing,just re encoding everything to 5 channel stereo just like that setting on my amp. I don't mind if it does that with games and 2 channel or mono stuff,but I was worried it was re encoding retail encoded 5.1 Dolby Digital streams you would get from a retail dvd movie or a avi movie with a full Dolby 5.1 track into plain 5 channel stereo. So if I get an avi movie file with a proper encoded 5.1 Dolby track in it,all I need to do is play it with say vlc player and then the Dolby Digital Live will pass the original 5.1 stream untouched to my amp,is that how it works. I was trying to find a Dolby Digital 5.1 test sound file of the net before to see if it is getting to my amp properly,some sought of test where it would play it to each speaker separately.

2nd October 2009, 7:54 PM	#5
thaFunkster Awaiting Email Confirmation Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 441	Good to hear it is all sorted. U can always disable that 5.1 upmixing in Dolby Pro Logic II on your soundcard if U like, and have it done through your Denon amp ( which would be better quality). But personally, I find it is easier to have all your setting as u want them on the soundcard and then you dont have to touch a thing on your amp except volume. I recommend you read through all the documenation that came with the sound card, there may be all kinds of things going on that you want to change. (Personally I am doing this, trying to get my setup to work properly, but the speakers have just been shipped back, less than a month after they arrived, hopefully next pair will be better), still had to fork out $60 for a damn courier though.

3rd October 2009, 2:57 AM	#6
garry Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Port Kennedy 6172 WA Posts: 2,362	Thanks yeah I tried to look for a 5.1 upmixing option on my sound card options buy couldn't see any mention of that option,unless creative call it something else,but like you said I think it is time I got the manual out and read up about everything the card does. The old onboard sound is so simple compared to these sound cards I think I would of been happy to stick with the onboard,I got the card now so I will try to set it up the best I can. Anyway thanks again for your help mate,sounds like your having trouble aswell,what was the problem with the speakers were they faulty and needed rmaing.

3rd October 2009, 7:01 AM	#7
thaFunkster Awaiting Email Confirmation Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 441	Yeah the speakers were faulty, I coulnt get it to recognise any digital input, but I think the amp/control centre that came with them was broken. The rear channel totally died. I will be getting a replacement soon from the retailer. But actually I wasnt that impressed with the sound. These are the logitech Z-5500, they are the top of the range from logitech, and almost the highest end computer speakers that you can buy, and I was really expecting a better sound than I have heard so far (especially when coupled with a good sound card like I bought). But maybe they will sound better when the replacement arrives. About your soundcard, from memory, its called CMSS - Creative Multi Speaker Surround, should have remembered that before. O, and that is a decent soundcard, when you have it set up, it should be good. You should be able to turn it up about twice as loud without distortion over onboard, and the quality should be a lot better.

4th October 2009, 1:15 AM	#8
garry Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Port Kennedy 6172 WA Posts: 2,362	Yeah sounds like you had a bit of bad luck there,least the replacements are on the ways I spose,Yeah I have never really got into pc speakers much I have always just plugged the pc into my denon surround amp with the b&w speakers,they sound pretty good,one of my friends bought a $65 pair of logitch speakers the other day and they sound like an old radio heh,but I spose you can't expect much for $65 anyway,your speaker setup would sound a 100 times better than the $65 jobs anyway. Like you said the replacements might end up better,what ever fault they had might of been causing sound problems aswell,hopefully that was the case. CMSS thanks I just seen that option,yeah it's just going to take some time I have realized to get this card setup the way I want,now I just found out that the new Red Faction Guerrilla game has real problems with this sound card so I got to wait for a patch before I play it,I was playing that game with my onboard sound a couple days before I bought that sound card without any problems at all,I just installed it today and found out it's got real problems,at least violation knows about it and are working on a patch http://community.redfaction.com/forums/topic/6551 Anyway thanks again for your help mate.

4th October 2009, 10:17 AM	#9
thaFunkster Awaiting Email Confirmation Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 441	No probs at all. Last thing, you know you can always disable, the sound card and re-enable onboard until the patch comes out....

4th October 2009, 7:11 PM	#10
garry Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Port Kennedy 6172 WA Posts: 2,362	Yeah I spose that's an idea,I would have to probably physically unplug the card,I am not sure if you can disable it in windows,I might even do that and play the game for a week or so till I finish it and then plug it back in again. Funny thing is I never had these sought of problems with the onboard.

4th October 2009, 8:30 PM	#11
thaFunkster Awaiting Email Confirmation Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 441	Yeah well with onboard its all integrated, so its all set up to work nice and easy. When you upgrade it always gets more complicated, but then the plus is you have more options for how you want to configure your system. What version of Windows are u running? You dont need to unplug them. Just go to control panel, right click on your soundcard, and choose "disable this device", then go to onboard right click and select "make default device". That should do it.