website concept advice/CC/help!

srey · 15th April 2010, 12:20 PM

Hey all, I'm in need of some assistance. First, a little background: for a while now my old man has been running a business building guitar amps. When he first started out a website was built, but since it hasn't really been redone in quite some time, it's really looking pretty disgraceful.

We've been talking about redoing it for quite some time, and it was kind of something I wanted to have a go at myself, but web design isn't my thing, and I understand that learning enough to make it work nicely probably isn't feasible at the moment. Thankfully though, a nice young designer has gotten in touch with the old man, and showed him a concept for the site. The general idea wasn't actually too far removed from what I'd been thinking, but I'm not a fan of the execution.

So what I did was quickly throw together a mockup of the idea I had in my head. Problem is, I'm not sure if it's actually a feasible idea, or if my thinking is incompatible with good web deisgn.

Sorry about the big pic, I can downsize it if you'd all prefer:

Now this is really only a concept, so don't worry about the background or photo and stuff, I was just playing around trying to get it looking sorta complete. The nav panel thing also needs some work too, the objects are too large and cubersome at the moment I think.

The idea is to have the content window in the box as a frame that scrolls as required, and have the rest of the box static. As far as the control panel part goes, I'd really like to see those knobs/switches/lights animated on mouseover (lights light up, knobs turn, switches flick). I also kind of want to make an animated, 3D fly around for an intro, but I think I'm getting carried away...

I know I can make the graphics needed to construct what I'm imagining, and could probably even make it work via PS/illustrator, but what I want to know is if it's a good idea or not? Is a graphic based website like this ok, or is it considered poor form? I can imagine being a bit clunky.

I know the presentation is probably a bit kitsch for most tastes, but I think the boss kind of wants something like that, rather than a crisp, modern style which would probably be my usual mode, but doesn't suit what he wants to show for the business.

So to all you web gurus out there, what would you think if a client of yours showed you a concept like this?
I don't want to be the sort of pain in the arse customer who just doesn't get it, but at the same time I don't want an idea to be ignored just because it doesn't suit one designers skillset/thinking.
I guess I'm just looking for a second opinion of sorts, before I go wasting the designer's time, and my own.

Cheers, Shayne.

Philll · 15th April 2010, 6:34 PM

I'm sure someone's put some time into it, but the fact you even had to ask to me is a hint that you have doubts yourself. It's kind of a good idea but it could have been so much better. If someone is going to use a site as a full graphic / flash display like that then you may as well go all out and make it look spiffy.

In point form:

- The background is plain and ugly, horrible colours too.
- The entire site would have to be, or be close to a single graphic. Sliced or not, because of the way it would have to be structured.
- Nav text isn't good for usability, it's hard to read and the stroke makes it worse.
- Nav buttons are weird, first two are lights and are not even considered to be clickable.
- Text is too small, there is no reason to really use 10/11pt anymore. Especially for content, that is unless the site is completely fixed, and the designer failed to leave space for more. It might be a good idea at first, until you get 5 months down the road and actually NEED more.
- The vinyl texture, around the edges, why such a contrasting outline on the top/bottom/left?
- The logo may as well be centered to the entire area, which it isn't.

Other than that, as I say, it looks like something from 1999 or 'my first site'. If you are using Flash (some people will boo it, it's still up to you though) you could create a masterpiece as there are no real limits.

If it wasn't going to be Flash and you asked any serious web designer if it was "incompatible with good web design" then you'd probably get a hasty 'yes'. If you'll be selling things through this site you also really don't want to alienate people who have JS/Flash turned off.

You could always achieve a similar good looking idea with HTML/CSS/JS. At the moment the design it where it's failing.

sparz14 · 15th April 2010, 7:13 PM

^^ what he said

srey · 15th April 2010, 7:31 PM

Yeap, the design needs work, like I said it was a quick throw together.
The image I posted isn't the designer's work either, it's based around a render I threw together using some parts I'd modelled for other tasks, along with some stuff I borrowed from his draft (font, copy etc).

You mentioned the site would have to be a single graphic; that's something that I understand, what I'm wondering is is that poor form for web design?
I imagine it'd prevent a dynamic scaling page, and that has limitations, but the concept that was presented to us was similarly fixed. Does it pose other major problems?

Actually, looks like the designer has his version up on his site, so I can show you that to give some more background I suppose.

Obviously that version is graphically a lot simpler, but my problem is that it kind of falls in no mans land between a more typical web page, and something that is really obviously object themed. I kind of want to go all the way with the object theme, I guess what I'm asking is if it's possible and within reason, or if we're talking really heavy design work for not a lot of yield.

If this doesn't make a lot of sense, apologies, I think I'm creating a tangle of different lines of thought in my head. Thanks for your reply Philll.

Philll · 15th April 2010, 7:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by srey

You mentioned the site would have to be a single graphic; that's something that I understand, what I'm wondering is is that poor form for web design?

It is when you want a site to load quick plus the obvious space for text issue which you're aware of.

Quote:

Actually, looks like the designer has his version up on his site, so I can show you that to give some more background I suppose.

What's with his corners? They are blurred and skewed, his link style at the bottom also blends in with the background on hover. It's still pretty average.

Anyway, I can maybe whip something up for you as an example of what would be cool from what you have here, if I get some time, check back in a few days.

sparz14 · 15th April 2010, 8:00 PM

aaargh the font burns my eyes

srey · 15th April 2010, 8:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philll

Anyway, I can maybe whip something up for you as an example of what would be cool from what you have here, if I get some time, check back in a few days.

If you get a chance mate that'd be cool, I'd love to see your take on it.

Personally, I just want to damn the practicalities and make it really different, but I suppose skewing content isn't exactly the best form either...

[IMG]

[/IMG]

biatch · 17th April 2010, 12:10 PM

Aaaayyyeeeeeeee..

Not unless you plan to use some sort of fuckery to skew the text also. Or make the text part of the image, in which case google will never be able to index your content!

aaayyeee myyy eeyyees

!nsane · 20th April 2010, 5:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by srey

If you get a chance mate that'd be cool, I'd love to see your take on it.

Personally, I just want to damn the practicalities and make it really different, but I suppose skewing content isn't exactly the best form either...

image
]image
[/URL]

I LOVE IT!!!!

if I was after a guitar amp, and came across that site, (and it was useable) I would be in for sure. that concept is frigging awesome! and given the propensity for 3d things starting to pop up, I think it makes a great effect, if its possible.

Taceo Corpus · 20th April 2010, 7:52 PM

Just saying, whoever let that "designer" anywhere near a HTML/CSS editor, a graphics editing or a web development package should be shot.

srey · 20th April 2010, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biatch

Not unless you plan to use some sort of fuckery to skew the text also. Or make the text part of the image, in which case google will never be able to index your content!

Yeah, obviously all of the content would need to be distorted to match the perspective. Not ideal, and that's why I was thinking it would be cool to animate a shift from perspective to front view, depending on the page; maybe only have the perspective bit for the 'home' page?

Quote:

Originally Posted by !nsane

I LOVE IT!!!!

if I was after a guitar amp, and came across that site, (and it was useable) I would be in for sure. that concept is frigging awesome! and given the propensity for 3d things starting to pop up, I think it makes a great effect, if its possible.

Thanks man; whether or not it's possible is one of the biggest problems I guess, and I just don't have the knowledge to know if it is. I can picture it in my head as a flash setup, but my first reaction would be that that's a lot of work.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dfcowell

Just saying, whoever let that "designer" anywhere near a HTML/CSS editor, a graphics editing or a web development package should be shot.

Mine or his? I'll freely admit I don't actually know what CSS really is, I'm just trying to express ideas visually, as I can't see an easier way to explain it.

Taceo Corpus · 20th April 2010, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by srey

Mine or his? I'll freely admit I don't actually know what CSS really is, I'm just trying to express ideas visually, as I can't see an easier way to explain it.

His, as I don't believe you referred to yourself in the third person as "designer."

I wouldn't trust him to go anywhere near one of my websites. His own home page doesn't render properly in Firefox, and all of his designs have absolutely no SEO qualities at all. Come on, graphical headers, honestly? The design he did up for you is simply shabby; parts of it are cut off and mangled, and it probably doesn't have cross-browser compatibility either.

15th April 2010, 12:20 PM	#1
srey Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 630	website concept advice/CC/help! Hey all, I'm in need of some assistance. First, a little background: for a while now my old man has been running a business building guitar amps. When he first started out a website was built, but since it hasn't really been redone in quite some time, it's really looking pretty disgraceful. We've been talking about redoing it for quite some time, and it was kind of something I wanted to have a go at myself, but web design isn't my thing, and I understand that learning enough to make it work nicely probably isn't feasible at the moment. Thankfully though, a nice young designer has gotten in touch with the old man, and showed him a concept for the site. The general idea wasn't actually too far removed from what I'd been thinking, but I'm not a fan of the execution. So what I did was quickly throw together a mockup of the idea I had in my head. Problem is, I'm not sure if it's actually a feasible idea, or if my thinking is incompatible with good web deisgn. Sorry about the big pic, I can downsize it if you'd all prefer: Now this is really only a concept, so don't worry about the background or photo and stuff, I was just playing around trying to get it looking sorta complete. The nav panel thing also needs some work too, the objects are too large and cubersome at the moment I think. The idea is to have the content window in the box as a frame that scrolls as required, and have the rest of the box static. As far as the control panel part goes, I'd really like to see those knobs/switches/lights animated on mouseover (lights light up, knobs turn, switches flick). I also kind of want to make an animated, 3D fly around for an intro, but I think I'm getting carried away... I know I can make the graphics needed to construct what I'm imagining, and could probably even make it work via PS/illustrator, but what I want to know is if it's a good idea or not? Is a graphic based website like this ok, or is it considered poor form? I can imagine being a bit clunky. I know the presentation is probably a bit kitsch for most tastes, but I think the boss kind of wants something like that, rather than a crisp, modern style which would probably be my usual mode, but doesn't suit what he wants to show for the business. So to all you web gurus out there, what would you think if a client of yours showed you a concept like this? I don't want to be the sort of pain in the arse customer who just doesn't get it, but at the same time I don't want an idea to be ignored just because it doesn't suit one designers skillset/thinking. I guess I'm just looking for a second opinion of sorts, before I go wasting the designer's time, and my own. Cheers, Shayne. __________________ Shayne

15th April 2010, 7:13 PM	#3
sparz14 Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: BRISBANE northside! Posts: 838	^^ what he said __________________ . 3570k // z77x-ud3h // 460GTX// 16gb 1600mhz ddr3 // CM gx750 // corsair h100 // 120gb ssd, 2tb sata3

15th April 2010, 7:31 PM	#4
srey Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 630	Yeap, the design needs work, like I said it was a quick throw together. The image I posted isn't the designer's work either, it's based around a render I threw together using some parts I'd modelled for other tasks, along with some stuff I borrowed from his draft (font, copy etc). You mentioned the site would have to be a single graphic; that's something that I understand, what I'm wondering is is that poor form for web design? I imagine it'd prevent a dynamic scaling page, and that has limitations, but the concept that was presented to us was similarly fixed. Does it pose other major problems? Actually, looks like the designer has his version up on his site, so I can show you that to give some more background I suppose. Obviously that version is graphically a lot simpler, but my problem is that it kind of falls in no mans land between a more typical web page, and something that is really obviously object themed. I kind of want to go all the way with the object theme, I guess what I'm asking is if it's possible and within reason, or if we're talking really heavy design work for not a lot of yield. If this doesn't make a lot of sense, apologies, I think I'm creating a tangle of different lines of thought in my head. Thanks for your reply Philll. __________________ Shayne

15th April 2010, 8:00 PM	#6
sparz14 Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: BRISBANE northside! Posts: 838	aaargh the font burns my eyes __________________ . 3570k // z77x-ud3h // 460GTX// 16gb 1600mhz ddr3 // CM gx750 // corsair h100 // 120gb ssd, 2tb sata3

17th April 2010, 12:10 PM	#8
biatch Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North Brisbane Posts: 1,687	Aaaayyyeeeeeeee.. Not unless you plan to use some sort of fuckery to skew the text also. Or make the text part of the image, in which case google will never be able to index your content! aaayyeee myyy eeyyees __________________ I have the ability of single-minded determination and focu... Hey, look! A horse!

15th April 2010, 6:34 PM	#2
Philll (Taking a Break) Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: NSW Posts: 10,962	I'm sure someone's put some time into it, but the fact you even had to ask to me is a hint that you have doubts yourself. It's kind of a good idea but it could have been so much better. If someone is going to use a site as a full graphic / flash display like that then you may as well go all out and make it look spiffy. In point form: - The background is plain and ugly, horrible colours too. - The entire site would have to be, or be close to a single graphic. Sliced or not, because of the way it would have to be structured. - Nav text isn't good for usability, it's hard to read and the stroke makes it worse. - Nav buttons are weird, first two are lights and are not even considered to be clickable. - Text is too small, there is no reason to really use 10/11pt anymore. Especially for content, that is unless the site is completely fixed, and the designer failed to leave space for more. It might be a good idea at first, until you get 5 months down the road and actually NEED more. - The vinyl texture, around the edges, why such a contrasting outline on the top/bottom/left? - The logo may as well be centered to the entire area, which it isn't. Other than that, as I say, it looks like something from 1999 or 'my first site'. If you are using Flash (some people will boo it, it's still up to you though) you could create a masterpiece as there are no real limits. If it wasn't going to be Flash and you asked any serious web designer if it was "incompatible with good web design" then you'd probably get a hasty 'yes'. If you'll be selling things through this site you also really don't want to alienate people who have JS/Flash turned off. You could always achieve a similar good looking idea with HTML/CSS/JS. At the moment the design it where it's failing.

20th April 2010, 7:52 PM	#10
Taceo Corpus Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gold Coast Posts: 2,759	Just saying, whoever let that "designer" anywhere near a HTML/CSS editor, a graphics editing or a web development package should be shot.