Console Fighting Games

Discussion in 'Game Consoles' started by elvis, Feb 1, 2006.

  1. proffesso

    proffesso Member

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    www.combovideos.com

    there is the latest Melbourne 3s tourny on there...a mad Gouki player from PaulT

    Gouki takes a lot of damage, and doesnt dish out a whole lot....but if you play him aggressivly...he can rush down like nothin else :)
     
  2. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Same cheap parts inside. If you are a casual gamer, then no worries. If you are serious and play regularly, they will really annoy you. Plus at $150 it makes for an expensive item to simply rip apart and replace with another $50 worth of real arcade parts.

    If you can pick up this stick for $50, it's worth it just to mod. On it's own for $150 it's a ripoff. Either find a cheaper stick and mod it, or build your own if you're handy with woodwork.

    OK, breaking it down: There are two major types of controls: American and Japanese. Of these, the best of each are:

    American Sticks:

    Happ Competition Pro:
    http://www.happcontrols.com/joysticks/competition_joy.htm
    The best microswitch-driven US sticks. The don't get stuck in the corners for rolling movements, and you don't have troubles finding corners for blocking like you do with the Happ Supers (which are inferior). They come standard with medium springs, but some people like to mod them with heavy springs for more resistance. They use "Cherry" microswitches which are regarded as the best in the industry, and rated to 10 million clicks. Your spring will probably go long before these switches will.

    Happ Perfect 360:
    http://www.happcontrols.com/joysticks/50608300.htm
    This is an optical joystick. No microswitches, and perfect sensors for easy 360 degree movement. They are more expensive and require a 5V input which can be hard to find depending on your circuitry. Nice if you don't like the "clicky" feel of the Comp Pro.

    American Buttons:

    Happ Competition Buttons:
    http://www.happcontrols.com/pushbuttons/5896xxl.htm
    These are new to Happ. They have a convex button which has come into fashion lately in the Japanese market. The exact same microswicthes as all Happ hear (cherry). 28mm wide shafts in these guys. Long threads, designed for wooden cabs (but can be used in metal cabs too)

    Happ Pushbutton with Horizontal switch:
    http://www.happcontrols.com/pushbuttons/5891xxl.htm
    These used to be called "Competitions", just to confuse everyone. They have the more traditional american concave button. Identical to the competitions asides from the button top itself. 28mm shafts. Long threads. These are my second-favourite for fighters, as they are tough as nails and take a beating.

    Japanese Sticks:

    Sanwa JLF:
    http://www.himuragames.com/images/joystick_8YT_02.jpg
    These are my personal favourites. Japanese sticks that are ultra sensitive with light springs. They are damned expensive, but luckily I've found a supplier who can get good deals on them. Some people think they feel too "loose". I know I did at first. But after playing with them for a few weeks I realised I was pulling out moves faster than ever, and no longer had to worry about the stick "not responding" from time to time. These are the "lollypop" sticks found in Japanese style "Candy Cabs".

    Seimetsu:
    http://www.himuragames.com/images/joystick_Seimitsu_01.jpg
    I've not used these myself. People who love them swear by them. I know a lot of manic shmuppers who say they'll never use anything else. One day I'll get some in just to try them out. They use the same size balltops as the Sanwa JLFs, so you can interchange them without any dramas.

    Japanese Buttons:

    Sanwa 30mm:
    Comes in two flavours - snap in:
    http://www.himuragames.com/images/buttons_30mm_01.jpg
    And screw in:
    http://www.himuragames.com/images/buttons_scr_san_30_02.jpg
    30mm make them slightly wider than a Happ button, and short threads on the screw in (and the mechanisms on the snap-ins) make them designed for thinner metal or plastic CPs (Control Panels). The microswitches are built into the buttons, and do not "click" like the cherry switches in a Happ button. They feel spongier to the touch, and like the Sanwa sticks don't require as much effort to push around as the Happ stuff. I like these for shmups where you are constantly pushing buttons for an hour long, and can get tired fingers. They're also great for combo-heavy games like MvC2 where there's a lot of constant button pushing involved.

    That's pretty much the list of the best parts for fighters. There are other brands and other sticks, but they aren't as good. Of those listed above, it's impossible for me to tell you which is "best" as it's all personal preference. For every Happ lover there's a Sanwa lover. For most it's a a case of what they grew up with. For me that's not the case, because I grew up on Happ and MCA (*ptu* I spit on MCA) sticks, and now love Japanese style stuff instead. Go down to your local arcade and see what they have installed. Try some different things out and see what you like.

    Oh, and don't buy MCA sticks ever:
    http://www.bigtop.com.au/images/product/Controls & Acc/Joystick-Blue2-x500.gif
    They are cheap, bulletproof and last a lifetime, which is why a lot of arcades use them. But the SUCK for fighting games. Not bad for old classics like Final Fight, Double Dragon, etc. But no good for precision games like the new fighters and shmups.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2006
  3. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Yeah, they nerfed Akuma big time for 3S, but really they had no choice. Making him as godlike as the storyline makes him out to be just simply would make the game way too unbalanced. Having said that, they still made Ken a little too powerful IMHO.

    But hey, 3S still ranks as a very balanced and well thought out game. It's a fighter game designed for fighting fans, and that's a good thing. Casual players won't like it, but it's the real fans that will be playing this 10 years after release, and thankfully Capcom decided to back us instead of the mass market.
     
  4. othy

    othy Member

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    I've recently been playing 3S, and as a 'novice' when it comes to fighting games, I have found it to feel more natural then SFA3. Its strange how they have ditched all the standard street fighter characters.

    --

    othy
     
  5. Bearz

    Bearz Member

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    RE: american/jap sticks

    I actually started out with american sticks for tekken, which is quite a fair bit of movement for the characters i play. I found that theres better defined direction (up, down-forward etc) compared to the jap ones, when i switch i was jumping all over the place at first.

    American ones also has a lot less give in terms of the distance it moves and feels like you have you have to push a bit harder for it to register.

    Button-wise i can't really tell the difference (not that i know), but i prefer the ones with a curve so your fingers can sit nicer..
     
  6. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    3S is very different to the other SF games out there. But then again, the vs are different to the old schools which are different to the Alphas which is different to the SF3's.

    I find 3S far more agressive than the other games. You are rewarded for good offensive play in 3S, especially with the parry system. I also find 3S more "technical" than the vs games which are more combo centric. The last game to be that "technical" in terms of game mechanics was either SF2:HF or SSF2:T.

    I dunno... just rambling now. Each game has its pros and cons, and generally speaking everyone has their favourite based on their style of play. For me, I enjoy MvC the most, although I find I win more often at SF2:HF (undefeated in the last 3 years!). Whether that's because fewer people play HF in my area or because I'm actually better at it, I don't know yet. I have a strong feeling it's the former. :)
     
  7. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Yup, Japanese sticks are far more sensitive. You have to be a bit rougher with US sticks. I used to be a huge fan of US sticks, but for some reason just changed in the last year. Maybe I'm getting old and weak and can't push the US sticks around as easily as I once did as a young sprout. :p

    They're all curved. The Happ Horizontals (old Competition) are concave (curved inwards), and the new Happ Competition and Sanwa 30mm's are curved outwards (convex).
     
  8. Bearz

    Bearz Member

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    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2946840734344220187&q=urien

    A matchplay vid with two of the more famous players (well justin at least). Kinda shitty quality but watch the 1st round, it's hellla funny :lol:

    Wish my urien was that cool :(

    Elvis: heh, shows how I actually know about buttons...can't really tell diff apart from the fact that some of them are more springy and 'easy' to press (don't really like those ones, it feels a bit too flimsy)
     
  9. Kaji

    Kaji Member

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    "LET'S GO JUSTIN!"

    And he proceeds to get parry owned. My friends and I always say this at the end of a round, just for distraction purposes.

    Works too :\
     
  10. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Pinched from an OzHadou post:

    Super Street Fighter 2: The New Challengers
    Zangief "all clear all perfect" video:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qnvr8T6K-k8&search=street fighter

    Note that it's "tool assisted" which means the author has used any combination of save states, programmable controllers, slow motion, etc. Still, some damned impressive 'Giefing there. He's one of my favourite characters, and it's great to see someone use him so well.
     
  11. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Pictures time! Clicky-clicky for bigger images.

    Fist off, my 3S arrived from Play-Asia on Friday. Pretty zippy. Cost me around $60 to get it to my door in under a week. Happy with that. Along side it was my one of my previous shmup purchases - the very awesome Mushihime Sama ("Insect Princess").
    [​IMG]

    And 3S on my 80cm (31") "fishbowl" CRT TV. (No, I don't have the money for a plasma - besides, a CRT TV looks more like an arcade monitor. Well, that's my excuse and I'm sticking with it :)):
    [​IMG]
    Currently playing on standard pads (yuck yuck yuck) until I get my cabs up and working.

    Next up, two of my cabs. Currently the left is a MAME cab with a 21" 31+KHz (VGA/SVGA) monitor. The right is a JAMMA arcade cab with 26" 15KHz (CGA/arcade) monitor.

    [​IMG]

    The plan is to do a total rearrange - my Dreamcast (off to the right where you can't see it) is going in the 21" VGA cab, as it can output native VGA (and looks bloody superb, just quietly). That will be for "Marvel vs Capcom 2", "Capcom vs SNK 2", "Soul Blade", and "Virtua Fighter 3". I can also play all of my Dreamcast shmups on there too, like Gigawing 2, Ikaruga, Shikigami no Shiro II, etc.

    Then the JAMMA cab will have a new and improved MAME box with proper low-res output via AdvanceMAME+Linux. More importantly, I've hacked up a SCART cable for my PS2, and with a bit of pullup circuitry I can now connect my PS2 directly to the arcade monitor. The picture is so bloody clear it makes your hair stand on end. Once my Sanwa joysticks and buttons arrive I'll by building a brand new control panel for it, and it will house my PS2 with 3S ("Street Fighter III: Third Strike" for the non-fighters), Tekken5, and my entire collection of crazy Japanese shmups (Mushihime Sama, E.S.P. Galuda, Ibara, Homura, Zanac X Zanac, etc). I'm keen as mustard to the PS2 release of the Street Fighter Alpha collection too. That will be a nice addition.

    I've purchased some JAMMA fingerboards for easy connection and disconnection of hardware. I'm going to rip apart two PS2 pads and wire them into the arcade joysticks and buttons via this connector. That also means that I can at any time continue to plug real arcade boards into the cabinet.

    And finally, the GameDude shop floor, where all the candies come out to play:
    [​IMG]
    In that photo are (listing fighting games only) Marvel Super Heros (CPS2 arcade system), Final Fight (CPS1 arcade system), TMNT (unique hardware), Street Fighter II: Hyper Fighting (CPS1), Street Fighter Alpha 3 (CPS2) and XMen vs Street Fighter (CPS2). Building quite a good collection of arcade hardware and game boards/systems there.

    I'm saving my pennies for at least 2 candies. I want one in "yoko" (horizontal) mode for fighting games, and one in "tate" (pronounced "tah-tay", short for "tateru" meaning rotated) for vertical shmups.

    A fun hobby for sure, but it gets expensive quickly. But what hobby doesn't? :)

    [edit]
    Oh, and for those who ask - the blue cabinet above was bought off eBay. The monitor chassis was busted bad (blown caps, broken trace, etc) so I had a mate fix that for me (I'm not brave enough to play with monitors - 20,000 volts can kill you or throw you across a room and break lots of bones). The CP (Control Panel) was very ugly, and the joysticks were busted. Not that I care, because I'd planned to refurbish it with new controls from day one anyway.

    The black MAME cab was a scratch-build. See the worklog here:
    http://benchmark.mameworld.net/cab1/

    Click the "images" link for all the goodies.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2006
  12. Wink

    Wink Member

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    This thread inspired me to get the Dreamcast back off my mate.

    mmm 3rd strike goodness is back but still can't beat Gill though - damn blue/red faggot.

    Going to practice more Yun/Yang.
     
  13. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    I've beat him a few times. You should have seen the look in my face after (1) my first Seraphic Wing defeat, and (2) my first "watch Gill rejuvinate and kick my arse" defeat.

    Much controller throwing ensued.
     
  14. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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  15. proffesso

    proffesso Member

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    he's just a pumped up urien, same attacks just a bit quicker with more damage...parry parry parry!

    Evo 2k5 trailer downloading now :thumbup: :leet:
     
  16. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Yeah, parries are my weakness. I'm still not used to the system. Too much oldschool Street Fighter makes Dan a turtle.

    50% downloaded over here. It's going to be a damn unproductive afternoon. :)

    [edit] :shock: Holy crap, I've got some practice to do!
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2006
  17. proffesso

    proffesso Member

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    haha shit yeah
     
  18. intrasonic

    intrasonic Member

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    Very professional trailer. However, the dual screen playback bit at the beginning was a little annoying. Had to rewind to see both sides. Oh well, still very dramatic.
     
  19. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Yeah I agree. I hate it when these fighting video kids put more than one movie onscreen at a time. My aging brain can't keep up.

    I was watching the "Ode to the 2-hit Combo" video last night from ComboVideos.com, and there's one bit where he has 16 videos in a grid onscreen at once. Bugger me if I didn't rewind and watch that bit 16 times.
     
  20. proffesso

    proffesso Member

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