Nicotinamide riboside supplementation for substantially longer, healthier life

Discussion in 'Science' started by antipody, Jul 24, 2016.

  1. samos

    samos Member

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    Interesting. I guess we need some more long term studies.

    I need to read into it more - have the NAD+ supplement lines come out yet :D someone is sure to pounce on it!
     
  2. RnR

    RnR Member

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    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/10/161027122047.htm
     
  3. antipody

    antipody Member

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    My first bottle of Niagen arrived in the post yesterday and I've had a couple of doses.

    I slept like a baby last night and felt great getting up this morning and at work all morning. NOthing amazing, but and quite likely placebo, but after feeling a bit run down all week I feel great today!

    I'll keep taking this bottle for a month and should really keep a diary to track the effects.

    I'm also going to send a bottle to my nan, who is turning 90 next year, so will be interesting to hear of her experience.

    Putting my n=1 science aside, just been reasding some of the research on links between metabolic state, cancer and ageing with NR.

    http://www.anti-agingfirewalls.com/...list-of-things-i-learned-about-aging-in-2013/

    2013 Cell Paper here:

    http://www.cell.com/abstract/S0092-8674(13)01521-3
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2016
  4. antipody

    antipody Member

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    Three days.

    This afternoon, I felt like I had too much coffee. I think it was because I had one. lol

    I went skating tonight and I feel like my leg muscles are stronger already :eek:

    My shinnie seems to be healing quicker than usual :paranoid:

    I feel like I might have a slightly less than normal appetite, but hard to konw.
     
  5. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle Member

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    BS it is diet and lifestyle, prove your statement!

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oldest_people

    Many of the oldest living people are from Japan and from very specific regions and islands and due to the cultural diets they have eaten for centuries.

    You think you know something..............but frankly provide any basis to this "chronic fasting" crap....and I don't mean something from mickey mouse club!

    Japan rocks for the oldies:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

    and it has nothing to do with chronic fasting............technically I understand what your trying to imply but it is wrong!

    Basically a constant rate of embodiment of positive molecules (in Japan it fish/sea products) leads to a longevity - nothing to do with fasting!
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2016
  6. Foliage

    Foliage Member

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    It is simple, less metabolism means less cell damage and less cell multiplication. The two main causes of dna damage. Dna damage is directly related to how old you will live.

    Here are two studies that show the mechanism. They are not just a crap correlative epidemiology study like most human ones either.

    Https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3946160/#!po=0.264550

    http://science.sciencemag.org/content/215/4538/1415

    Diet and lifestyle obviously have an impact but Japan follows this rule as well, their average daily calories are much lower than the us, this is one major reason for them living longer.
     
  7. antipody

    antipody Member

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    Actually, calorie restriction is one of the only activities shown to increase longevity.

    DNA damage due to lower metabolism may be one reason, but if you listen to this talk, by Dr Dominic D'Agostino, he goes into great detail about the longevity (and performance) benefits that come with ketosis, which is induced by fasting.

    He mentions several books that go into the very interesting details of the metabolic basis (and metabolic/diet treatment) of cancer.

    Some of the take outs I got are that cancer cells are an "aberrent metabolic phenotype", in that they can only use glycolysis. So, by fasting, you can starve cancer cells (and pre-cancerous cells), and allow your immune system to clear them. He also talks about triggering apoptosis in cancer cells through their mitochondria, although I don't remember if this was part of fasting or drug induced.

    If you look there's lots of really interesting science connecting metabolic state, cancer and longevity.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2016
  8. RnR

    RnR Member

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    Just on this bit... I came across a comment somewhere that stated that (paraphrasing) - ketones when consumed as energy produces far fewer free-radicals than standard carb fuel.

    It was pretty late at the time of reading, and I didn't pursue that line of thought any further. Could be crap, but sounds interesting anyways. Does anyone have any links or insights to this?
     
  9. antipody

    antipody Member

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    It's worth listening to the entire talk, but go to 2:53 where Dom talks about how ketones enhance mitochondrial efficiency, reducing free radical formation from the electron transport chain in mitochondria, in addition to boosting mitochondrial density and performance.

    A bit earlier (2:48) he talks about the antiinflammatory effects of ketones (regarding lyme disease).
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2016
  10. Foliage

    Foliage Member

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    Another example that backs up the calorie restriction is there is a small population of dwarves with a genetic mutation stopping then from producing normal amounts of igf1 (different to normal dwarves). They have lower levels of cancer and live longer due to their cells preferring to repair themselves over splitting. The same behaviour is seen in times of low energy (calorie restriction) cells prefer to repair themselves that splitting to get stronger.

    Splitting cells means replicating dna which shortens the polymeres and hence causes a risk of dna mutation which could cause cancer and lower your life expectancy.

    I'll see if I can dig up and article about them.

    So what do you have to say now bold eagle? Do you retract your previous abusive reply that came out of nowhere?
     
  11. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle Member

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    I will still present a hypothesis that high quality molecular intake (gas, liquid, solids) is significantly correlated to longevity.

    That is provide high value "building blocks" in the form of clean water, air and food products and you will achieve greater longevity.

    Starvation may reduce metabolic activity but if that organism is absorbing medium to poor quality molecules (for example polluted air or water) they will have a reduced longevity potential.

    Moreover, if we compared the [faster to the normal consumer (variable: consumption ratio)] in either [poor/moderate vs high quality environments (variable: ecosystems)] I bet there would be a far greater significant correlation in ecosystem vs consumption rate.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2016
  12. Foliage

    Foliage Member

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    What is a "quality molecule". Everything is a molecule, there is no such thing as quality when it comes to molecules.

    You asked me to provide evidence and I did (you also berated me for no reason). Now it is your turn. Firstly you must define what a "quality molecule" is and how to identify it, secondly you need to reference a study that identifies these "quality molecules" and provides a mechanism as to how they provide longevity.

    Epidemiology (correlation) is extremely basic science that gives you nothing more than a hint at what you should actually study. It does not prove anything. Once you've identified a correlation you must then identify the actual mechanism upon which it is caused.

    So far I've provided a correlation (longevity vs extended/chronic fasting) and also the mechanism upon which it has been shown to work. Eg reduction in IGF-1 causing less cell division coupled with reduced oxidative stress due to slower metabolism. "I bet" doesn't cut it in the science forum, nor do basic epidemiological studies.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2016
  13. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle Member

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    You did post links but one fails to load the other hints exactly at my point "nutrient-enriched diets", that is quality molecules.

    You deserve a better response than this, but if you go to google scholar and try "high-value molecules" (quality) and consider them being absorbed (gas, liquid or solid) and what the outcomes may be (chelating, displacing, etc during the absorption phase - especially considering diffusion) :

    http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/ja310054d (a gas)

    http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10811-013-9983-9 (solid)

    I am still searching for the "keyword structure" that could support my hypothetical.

    Edit: this looks like a good read;
    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S009286740080567X

    Supporting your view;

    Damn I wasn't meaning to support your argument.......
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2016
  14. sanousie

    sanousie Member

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    This stuff is really good, been taking it for about 1 month now, about 50 - 100mg Of pharm grade purity 99 percent say 3 days on and 2 days off, and the stuff really has helped with motivation and quality of sleep. From my observations, the elderly that keep active (are motivated to do something with their day) live longer and its known that quality of sleep does improve life, So this shit really works, lols.

    Thanks for this thread, Great info.
     
  15. Foliage

    Foliage Member

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    N = 1

    Self experimentation is extremely prone to error and placebo effect.
     
  16. antipody

    antipody Member

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    I've been sleeping well too so far.

    Apparently the suprachiasmatic nucleus timekeeper function is SIRT dependent, so perhaps that explains it.

    http://genesdev.cshlp.org/content/27/19/2072.full

    Red light reaching the pineal gland via the retina will cause it to release melatonin and I find running f.lux on my computer may also be helping me get better sleep (I don't have a smartphone, but I think it runs on them too). I also have a cool red LED on the back of my bed I'll often turn on, as well as a red lamp in my lounge room lol.

    You're right. Placebo or not, it's really good for you.
     
  17. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle Member

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    Don’t believe the HYPE about Nicotinamide Riboside

    Fishing with that above.....

    Damn if you go to google scholar and keyword: Nicotinamide riboside;

    Here we can see that a Bogan wrote about it but also clearly defining we need a baseline:
    http://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev.nutr.28.061807.155443

    Next...

    The NAD+ Precursor Nicotinamide Riboside Enhances Oxidative Metabolism and Protects against High-Fat Diet-Induced Obesity

    The high value question is what is most readily available, cost effective and thus high value form?

    It needs to be Cochrane Review for greater resolution:
    http://www.cochrane.org/search/site/Nicotinamide riboside

    So far only two assessments..............
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2016
  18. antipody

    antipody Member

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    Observations at the end of bottle one of NR - 60 x 125mg. Roughly 1 per day:

    Sleep appeared to improve
    Skating has improved
    Mood fine (but I tend to always be pretty baseline fine)
    Performing well at work (although with long service leave around the corner I think I am just glowing anyway)
    Appetite felt perhaps slightly surpressed but in a good way

    As a complete confounding influence, I also tried a mild nootropic called Utopia(n) at the tail end of the NR trial. The effect of that stimulant felt a lot more noticable. As a stimulant, that is not something to take a daily dose of, as NR is being marketed for, but I took one hit one afternoon in which I felt like a skating deity. Taking a second Utopia(n) dose the next day just made me feel like I was hooked on beetlenut, so I haven't had a third try of that one :paranoid:

    With a general feeling of improved health, I am considering purchasing a second bottle of NR though. I think I will go for a few weeks without it and see how I feel first.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2016
  19. antipody

    antipody Member

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    Another article worthy of attention in Feb 17 Science.

    Vitamin B3 modulates mitochondrial vulnerability and prevents glaucoma in aged mice

     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2017
  20. antipody

    antipody Member

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    And another...

    http://science.sciencemag.org/content/355/6331/1312

    :leet:
     

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