Ageia PhysX results online

Discussion in 'Video Cards & Monitors' started by eva2000, Apr 27, 2006.

  1. mr_wrxman

    mr_wrxman Member

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    This seems like such a waste of money, and i reckon the shitty thing is, by the time it becomes bigger, it'll be just like a video card. You have to spend a shit load just to play games, it's gonna be out of control. Just like with vid cards, come on...$1800 is the top for playing games, with more expensive and higher end cards coming out quicker than anything.

    Doesn't anyone think this is ridiculous? I'd be really really pissed off when it gets to the point that the minimum system requirements are a physics card. So for any system to play a game decently, you'd need high end vid. card, (say single solution), $800, physx card, $500, quick cpu, $400, that's almost to grand to play a friggin game.

    I remember reading somewhere that nvidia and ati were trying to implement a physx card type thing in a 2nd video card if you have SLi or crossfire. So you ahve 2 video cards, one doing phyics and one doing video. This seems alright, but still, i think they're just leeching money off us. Then the less fortunate kids will look like a loser because they can't play unreal tournmanent 2032 at 16000x10000 reso with 40x AA and 50x AF at 100fps.
     
  2. manflesh

    manflesh Member

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    Well they know there are people who gotta have the latest tech so they'll charge the most they can before dropping the price, either way I think it's crazy to drop $499 for something that's got little game support right now, I'm sure it's gonna have alot in the future...like most people I'm gonna wait and see what happens.
     
  3. mr_wrxman

    mr_wrxman Member

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    Question

    What about multiplayer?

    Since its being processed randomly my the ppu, no two scenes would be the same. Say with css, if i were to shoot a bunch of barrels and chairs and stuff to block a stairway, but the same phyics aren't processed at someone else's comp. WHat happens then? Does that mean that it would only be avaliable for single player? If its gonna be for MP, that would mean that the game would be screwed or the ppu would only be there to pretty up the scene with particles of dust and crap which doesn't do much
     
  4. lazyboy1984

    lazyboy1984 Member

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    for someone who spends $2k everytime he upgrades SLI video cards, surely $499 is a small price to pay for the latest and greatest physics effects?
     
  5. nexx

    nexx Member

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    Who said it was random?

    I think a separate card for physics acceleration is either unwanted, unneeded or simply ahead of its time. I always hoped they'd develop a standard ppu and embed it in motherboards or something to save everybody this whole mess.

    NVIDIA has already demonstrated Havok physics being accelerated on its GPU's and results seem at least on par with what Ageia have to offer. So it seems some competition has risen already...which can only benefit consumers.
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2006
  6. TOX

    TOX Member

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    This company also lists it @ $499. I was going to order one except I have got a sample coming now :) I can't wait to get into Ghost Recon with it.
     
  7. WuZMoT

    WuZMoT Member

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    fancy bullcrap

    call me critical (but hey if you're paying $400 - 500 for accurate physics) but would'nt the first dumpster that cops a grenade move or explode away from the player somewhat.
    Theres nothing behind it stopping it from moving and the explosion only seems to come towards the player.
    Dumpsters are heavy but if a grenade can blow the fuckers to pieces it can move them.

    Its not really that impressive or worth the money if you ask me.
     
  8. Vladdo

    Vladdo Member

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    Very true.. I think its also true that for a true physics model to be complete, you must have destructable environments as well, instead of just static objects. As someone has pointed out tho, this is just the beginning steps at a much more complete picture (in terms of physics) so it would be far to say that give it 5 years and after Revision 5 of the card or something, gaming will be on a totally different level. If anyone has had a quick glimpse of that next Crysis game you'll see that physics is becoming much more integrated into DX10, so perhaps this product is just a stopgap measure.. only time and guinea pigs will tell...
     
  9. lowdog

    lowdog Member

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    Yes it's ridiculous isn't it. :o I have learn't my lesson though and my upgrade cycle is now around 16 to 24 months. I'm over spending money on useless computer components.
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2006
  10. TOFUGil

    TOFUGil Member

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    Games will get more complicated so as someone mentioned alredy its a move to that...it doesn't mean u need it..its only for those who wants everything with fully candy eye & can afford..much like the current high-end videocard or SLi or Crossfire..

    If u're on a budget then just buy what u can afford..simple...
     
  11. al'Thor

    al'Thor Member

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    What about this - your ina game and you try to sneak up on an enmy he has a Physics card and can hear the grass russal and escapes then his mate walks up behind you and pops 1 in your head because you didn't hear hm comming up behind you ?(because you don't have one)

    It's not a sound card I hear you saying . but if the leaves of grass are made break when you walk on them - you could hear that .
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2006
  12. AMD64

    AMD64 Member

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    a normal cpu and sound card could that no trouble :S
     
  13. mr_wrxman

    mr_wrxman Member

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    By random i mean the outcome. For example, what happens when you drop a ball, it doesn't always drop and bounce in the same way everytime. If you take this with a game where you can be killed from the debris of an explosion, what if in one scenario it misses you, but in another it hits you and kills you. In order to correct this online, you'd need an EXTREMELY fast connection in order to compensate for the differences in scenarios.

    I think if it were scripted, there wouldn't be much point of a PPU...it could be...well a script. i.e. the explosions would be exactly the same everytime.
     
  14. AMD64

    AMD64 Member

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    the only way i can see online play possible , is if online the card only adds graphical effects.....
     
  15. SpicEwEazle

    SpicEwEazle Member

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    all I can think of, is that all the extra shit flying around has to be rendered by your gfx card, so there will be a point that the ppu will probably decrease perfomance on some systems.
     
  16. stmok

    stmok Member

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    But that's the thing. In engineering, you can only get sufficiently accurate up to a point.

    At University, (well the one I go to), we calculate to a certain accuracy by hand (OUCH!) or by PC, but we then throw in about a 10% safety factor. (Yes, some of our projects are used in real life...Scaryingly enough). :Paranoid:

    This is just in case if the crapper does hit the fan and to account for manufacture defects or possible accuracy issues (round off?)...My friend at Boeing says this number is reduced to 2%. (Because they can reach such high precision with the resources and money they have.)

    I agree it has to be accurate, but it doesn't have to be 100% spot on, because its impossible to reach that level without costing you somewhere...Not even NASA can reach that level. (Sure they can get to 99%. But that's more than good enough!)

    It has to be about 90% to 95% accurate. Then you throw in the "safety factor" to account for accuracy lost. Its the same with 64bit calculations...Cost-wise, 64bit is slower but more accurate than 32bit. I know this as I've played around with both Ansys (FEA) and Fluent (CFD).


    I guess what I'm thinking with the PhysX PPU, is to have an affordable number cruncher for the "backyard engineer". (It has sufficiently accurate such that you can make practical projects with it...Well, until you make your world famous widget that you can earn millions on!) :D

    So I'm picturing a low cost "accelerator"...Instead of those $20,000 per custom CPU solution. (There is one that allows you to install it into a Socket 940 mobo. You have to install it into a spare socket, but is still about $4,500 per CPU)...Affordable for a business, but completely out of reach for an engineer who's tight on money.


    The only way to really find out how accurate this PPU is, is to do four tests with a custom built FEA app. (I'm thinking about writing one).

    (1) Test CPU Part 1 => 32bit accuracy
    (2) Test CPU Part 2 => 64bit accuracy
    (3) Test PPU Part 3 => 32bit accuracy
    (4) Test PPU Part 4 => 64bit accuracy

    We time how long each will take, then compare it with the value as determined by theory. (so we have a reference point to measure off in terms of accuracy).

    This is how I would do it.
     
  17. HeXa

    HeXa Member

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    just a little bit of welcome news for those going :wired: at the $499 price...

    DELL Australia now offer the PhysX card as a $366.30 option on the Dimension 9150 desktop - it might be possible to order a card through their spare parts service for hopefully not much more :)

    - HeXa
     
  18. RoboBust

    RoboBust Member

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    Lots of people seem to disagree. And how is your idea any better? Then people who don't even want the chip have to pay for it anyway, and it would steal system memory. I know it's been said a thousand times already, but people were saying this kind of stuff back in the early days of 3d acceleration.

    Link please, I've seen nothing which suggests their solution is anywhere near on par with Ageias.

    Don't blame poor implementation from the game developers on the hardware. It's obvious that's the only video you bothered watching, I suggest checking out the CellFactor vid.
     
  19. hot 1000

    hot 1000 Member

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    3xtimes the heat

    But the big Question is will it fit in a mobo with two video cards in SLI [two slot coolers] and three pci slots . From the photo it has a HSF so will it fit with a sound card in one of the pci slots?
     
  20. Reaper

    Reaper Member

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    I thought Nvidia bought Ageia and would be implementing the hardware into their future video cards.... Or did I dream it?

    But until they can make this device useful for all DX/OGL games, (yes, all past games too), then I won't be buying one soon as the supported games list is a big snore for me. (99% are FPS). Probably too hard to do, so maybe in a few years when every game makes use of it, it would be a much better buy then. They have to start somewhere, so now will do, then later they'll see a mass take up of it as it's in the market place more. Just like what happened with 3d acceleration, (as others have mentioned).
     

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