All in one flea and worm treatment?

Discussion in 'Pets & Animals' started by jtir, May 9, 2012.

  1. jtir

    jtir Member

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    I have been a long time user of the following products:

    • Advocate
    • Frontline Plus with a chewable heart/intenstinal wormer such as Drontal or Heartgard

    The above are external topical, so you can't wash them, play with kids etc during the initial application.

    I have just bought something called "Panoramis" which is mean't to be a chewable all-in-one for fleas and worms.

    Has anyone used a similar product before? Are there any side effects I should be concerned about?
     
  2. MR CHILLED

    MR CHILLED D'oh!

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    I tend to use Sentinel for all these requirements. He won't eat the chews so I need to cut them up and add to his meal.
     
  3. Spyder6052

    Spyder6052 Member

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    for worming (intestinal,heart, etc) and brown cattle tick prevention i use Ivamec Antiparasitic Injection (for cattle) although i medicate them orally instead of injecting. I give my dogs 1ml a month and havent seen a tick anywhere. cost is about $100 for a 200ml bottle so works out a hell of a lot cheaper than any of the mainstream stuff. only downside is it doesnt control fleas.
     
  4. millhouse

    millhouse Chief Tiger Dentist

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    Use this advice with caution.
    The dose rate of 1ml per dog per month will kill numerous dogs out there, and be ineffective for many others.
     
  5. Spyder6052

    Spyder6052 Member

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    yes definitely read the instructions and if you are unsure consult your vet.

    I havent had any issues with this dosage (my dogs weigh in between 20- 40kg)
     
  6. broccoli

    broccoli Member

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    My dogs get their heartworm prevention by annual injection.
     
  7. millhouse

    millhouse Chief Tiger Dentist

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    If people want to use the injectable Ivermectin, please speak to a vet first. Ther are NO instructions on the injectable box/bottle for dogs.

    Just chatting to a specialist today who had a dog come down from Cloncurry that is in a coma because of a problem with Doramectin. Unluckily they have found out this dog is extremely susceptible to Avermectin toxicity (confirmed with a DNA test).

    Be aware that use of this drug in this form is off label and the manufacturer's will not help you if something goes wrong.
     
  8. MR CHILLED

    MR CHILLED D'oh!

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    What products would you recommend? (if you are ok to recommend them)
     
  9. millhouse

    millhouse Chief Tiger Dentist

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    My recommendations:
    - Comfortis for fleas
    - ProHeart SR12 for heartworm
    - Milbemax or Drontal for Intestinal worms
    - Advantix (fortnightly) and Kiltix collar for Paralysis ticks (drop Comfortis if using this combo)
     
  10. the_fuzz

    the_fuzz Member

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    any particular reason your not a fan of sentinal?
     
  11. millhouse

    millhouse Chief Tiger Dentist

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    The theory behind Sentinel is great. The practicality is terrible for most.

    As an intestinal wormer and heartwormer the product is as good as any. I have no problem in recommending Interceptor (its non flea control cousin) as a monthly product for heartworm and intestinal worms.

    The flea control is Sentinel's downfall. The way that Lufenuron works is brilliant - it is ingested by fleas and inhibits proper chitin formation. This affects the ability of the eggs that are laid to hatch, thus breaking the life cycle. In a closed system it works perfectly by inhibiting the replenishment of new fleas, controlling the population.

    Most animals are not in a closed system.
    a) non lufenuron trreated animals can bring eggs into the environment
    b) lufenuron treated animals can come accross adult fleas in other environments (this is the reason Novartis developed Capstar).

    ALL animals in the dog's environment MUST be on a Lufenuron product - Sentinel for Dogs and Program for Cats. ALL of the animals must stay in a controlled environment, whereby they cannot go to other areas where non lufenuron treated fleas may have laid eggs. Cats are also responsible for transferring hatchable eggs to other animal's environments via their wanderings.

    If the animals go to other environments where non lufenuron fleas have laid eggs, they will be bitten by adult fleas. These fleas will then lay eggs that cannot hatch, but for the dog that is Flea Allergic this is of no consequence, the damage is done again.

    People generally do not treat all animals, and they do not control the access of animals to other environments.
     
  12. bsbozzy

    bsbozzy Member

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    We use panoramis and cannot complain, dog is in good health, no worms, no fleas.
     
  13. the_fuzz

    the_fuzz Member

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    Only have 2 dogs and both are "sentinaled" every month - are you saying that taking them walking is a possible way to get fleas?
     
  14. broccoli

    broccoli Member

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    Millhouse, when you are talking about Sentinel, are you including Advantage or Frontline (plus)? They have the "flea-sterilizing" drug in them, don't they? What's the deal with them (I get one or the other), are they any good. What's the comfortis one got?

    The reason I ask is that I've never had an issue with any of my pets, but my latest dog pulled out a hunk of fur and the doctor said he could have a flea bite sensitivity and a flea might have bitten him. If his spot on isn't that good, I'll change to something better. Thanks.
     
  15. millhouse

    millhouse Chief Tiger Dentist

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    It is possible.

    If they go to an area where non Lufenuron treated flea eggs have been deposited, then yes, these eggs go on to hatch, the larvae burrow a bit and then pupate. Waiting inside the cocoon is an immature flea waiting to jump on your pet. This is the reason people talk about "Grass" or "Sand" fleas - the reality is that there is no such thing. They are the offspring of the common Cat Flea which has cycled from an egg dropped off a dog or cat that was walking in the area.

    Possible, but not terribly likely to receive a large burden of fleas on your dog. If they do, the fleas will bite them, but of course the eggs they lay will not hatch, so no flea cycle will develop in your environment from those fleas.

    Just talking about Sentinel, and specifically the active drug in it called Lufenuron. Advantage has Imidiclopramid and Frontline has Fipronil. To my knowledge these products "sterilise" the fleas by knocking out their nervous systems and killing them. There is no specific reproductive effect except for death.

    Advantage and Frontline are fine. However I have had many clients omplain about the ineffectiveness of Frontline. This may be due to the large number of people using it (statistically more people talk) or that the product is not as effective (product failure). Fipronil is used in many products involved with pest control, so there is a lot of potential for resistence to occur. In saying that the majority of people do not use these types of products properly - once every 4 weeks all year around. The gaps in treatment, a week here, a month or two there, are opportunities for fleas to continue their life cycle.

    Comfortis contains Spinosad - this is a relatively new compound from a rarely used drug group. It is I think related to Capstar (can't recall the active). So far, reports have been excellent on its use. The cat version is on its way soon.

    Flea bite allergy is a nasty problem. The reality is that only a single flea need bite your pet and deposit their saliva under the skin. This is what the animal's immune system reacts to. So because it can be induced by literally a single flea, it is difficult to completely control if your pet has access to uncontrolled environments. The biggets mistake people make is thinking that their animal needs to be riddled with fleas to develop this condition. The other is that fleas are associated with an unkempt or unclean environment - not the case at . Dogs and Cats get fleas.
     
  16. the_fuzz

    the_fuzz Member

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    Thanks for taking the time - much appreciated.
     
  17. StarDrifter

    StarDrifter (Banned or Deleted)

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    Millhouse, Panoramis is the new all in one, like Sentinel but with Spinosad and Milbemycin ;)

    In case you missed that.

    PANORAMIS is what you should use
     
  18. MR CHILLED

    MR CHILLED D'oh!

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    I do use Sentinel and have not ever seen a flea on my mutt, fwiw.
     
  19. millhouse

    millhouse Chief Tiger Dentist

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    Sounds better than Sentinel.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2012
  20. StarDrifter

    StarDrifter (Banned or Deleted)

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    Yeh it's like Sentinel, monthly chewable tablet that does fleas, intestinal worms and heartworm.

    Except it uses Spinosad instead of Lufenuron... :) WinNAH!
     

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