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Apple to Announce its own Mac Processor

Discussion in 'Apple Desktop Hardware/Software' started by aokman, Jun 10, 2020.

  1. flu!d

    flu!d Never perfect, always genuine

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    The last brand new iMac I tried to configure with Bootcamp ended in massive failure that Apple quite simply weren't interested in. I could get Bootcamp to work, but not for long - Every time it would corrupt within days.

    It could have been a Windows issue, I'm not discounting that. However, I can run bootcamp on my 2012 Mac Mini and 2012 MacBook Pro just fine. In the end the client bought a Wintel laptop and the iMac just sits there as he doesn't like the interface.
     
  2. OP
    OP
    aokman

    aokman Member

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    I have never understood why anyone uses bootcamp... Use Parallels and get better flexibility and battery life. Expecting Apple to make Windows support their top priority is not a reasonable expectation lol.
     
  3. Zee

    Zee Member

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    Interesting, I've had success with Bootcamp on my current Macbook air (which is actually a 2014 model, I guess) and a few 2018 Macbook Pro 13" units. Have not tried with iMacs, as my Desktop PC tends to be a gamer, hence... A Windows job.

    Z...
     
  4. Zee

    Zee Member

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    It works, I had a license, and I didn't expect any support from Apple (nor did I need it). In fact, I'd argue that my Macbook Air runs Windows as well as any native Windows PC I've ever had (better, in fact).

    Also, you *never* get compatibility issues with software. I still see the odd Parallels issue on the various work related forums I'm on. Not often, mind, but still...

    Z...
     
  5. [KEi]SoVeReIgN

    [KEi]SoVeReIgN Member

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    Oh that was on purpose to fluid, not to you - His first response was a piss poor troll and he didn't put any effort into making a decent argument until called out.

    Assuming you aren't talking about ASX200 companies - Although either way no such thing as unmanaged BYOD, the device management and overheads required are basically the same.

    You're right BYOD is a well used concept especially in the mid market, although funnily enough I've seen a handful of 'BYOD' programs designate iOS only because of significant security advantages - i.e Cost savings on the device wrapped in the thin veneer of 'choice'.

    In my mind vast majority = 80%+

    Regular consumers = Non technical, non 'pro' users. Students, teachers, florists, casual artists, writers etc.
    Not taking the piss here, but people in this thread are making sweeping statements like "Apple are making consumers feel duped" and "People are buying Airs because of X" with no supporting evidence then placing the burden of proof on the rebuttal.
    I'm just talking from experience, but feel free to ignore it - It's just another internet opinion after all.

    The upgrade path is definitely poor, although its not hugely different to the competition - MS Surfaces haven't been able to upgrade ram since forever, plenty of others are equally bad. You could correctly argue Apple are at fault for leading that charge.
    Just means the cost has to get factored into the device upfront. e.g +$10% device cost on overpriced ram to extend expected lifespan by 1-3 years.

    ~2 year turnarounds can make some sense when you're getting a stupidly good 2 year residual and you're only leasing the delta. Turns what could be a horrible cost conversation about buying Macs you can sweat for 7 years into a fascinating TCO model but thats a tangent this thread probably doesn't need to go down.

    IMO MacOS + Windows in a VM = Worse battery life than Windows in bootcamp. (Which is already poor)

    I use bootcamp often for native performance in applications that are Windows only. Parallels and VMWare can't get close.

    The best of computing is launching Bootcamp/EFI volumes from VMWare within MacOS for convenience, then restarting to a native OS install if you needed native performance

    Losing bootcamp and X86/X64 Windows is my personal biggest disappointment with the ARM announcement.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 30, 2020
  6. flu!d

    flu!d Never perfect, always genuine

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    This was a 2018 model iMac, no matter what I did it wouldn't work reliably and Apple couldn't have given a hoot. I don't expect Apple to support another operating system, but I expect their official solution to actually work on supported hardware. Upon researching the issue during diagnosis I definitely wasn't alone in my problems.

    I'm not advising client's run Parallels, as there is no doubt that running an OS inside an OS as a VM on an already limited iMac (remember, most can't afford top of the line devices anymore and entry level iMac's have 5400RPM HDD's and fairly modest for a PC specs) is going to result in performance issues depending on what the client intends to do with that machine.
     
  7. OP
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    aokman

    aokman Member

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    Was more referring to Apple being expected to officially support Windows somehow on ARM. They are focused on their own goals and moving forward, not supporting Windows. I am very sure we will see Parallels X86 Windows emulation somehow and I actually think Apples chips will be able to do it with good performance still.

    I have never seen any issues with the most recent versions of Parallels, VMware Fusion on the other hand, yes that can burn in a fire. Parallels even notifies me when Windows is trying to install its stupid updates :lol:

    No way, latest Parallels gets amazing battery life with its suspend functions and my Macbook doesn't even get warm. Bootcamp would kill the battery in no time, same with VMware Fusion.
     
  8. flu!d

    flu!d Never perfect, always genuine

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    Well, what goes for Elvis goes for me also. I'm entitled to my opinion in the same way your entitled to your own, I'd appreciate it if you'd quit with the partonising comments.

    If you want me to expand on a comment, asking nicely usually gets better results.

    I fail to see how that could be the case TBH.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 30, 2020
  9. [KEi]SoVeReIgN

    [KEi]SoVeReIgN Member

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    I'm responding to his and your post content, not his username, or your username for that matter.

    Well reasoned respectful posts = engaged conversation
    Silly troll statements = not engaged conversation

    Surely you've worked that out by now based on how everyone responds to your troll posts in motoring etc.
     
  10. flu!d

    flu!d Never perfect, always genuine

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    You're personally attacking again, are you even aware you do it?
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2020
  11. OP
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    aokman

    aokman Member

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    Try it and see, travel mode and instant suspend power functions stop Windows running its shit in the background and chewing resources. VMware Fusion is a dumpster fire, has been for years.

    Don't even waste your time, blows my mind that OCAU constantly lets trolls run rampant through Apple threads offering no constructive discussion other than bitching about how Apple won't make the products they want and everything is a conspiracy against them like Tim Cook reads these threads or even gives a shit :lol:
     
    [KEi]SoVeReIgN likes this.
  12. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    I quoted two things. One to me, one to flu!d . I don't see the trolling you're talking about, but regardless, I'm asking you to join me in improving this thread that's seen ups and downs.

    Which is also why I recommend against the MS Surface series. I don't subscribe to the idea that just because one big company does it, it's OK for another. There exist plenty of upgradable "ultrabook" style devices that don't require us to put up with either Microsoft's nor Apple's nonsense. Zero surprises that prominent phone manufacturers are jumping in on that market in 2020, especially with Apple pushing customers away.

    For example, I saw one site a couple of years back dump their MacBook fleet for HP Spectre machines. Regardless of your or my personal take on that, they cited the increased flexibility of that platform as one of the core reasons for the change. I understand that's yet another "anecdote of one" case, but I see similar frequently enough to note the patterns.

    You yourself cite how excellent Apple hardware is. It makes sense that if people agree with that opinion, but "need" Windows for whatever reasons (vendor lock in, corporate requirements, legacy software, etc), then bootcamp gives them the best of both worlds.
     
  13. flu!d

    flu!d Never perfect, always genuine

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    I've been using Parallels for years. TBH I haven't really seen any difference in power consumption, having said that I haven't really been looking. I'll be sure to pay more attention.

    However, outright performance vs native is still an issue regarding VM's.
     
  14. mAJORD

    mAJORD Member

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    It's not that PCMR would hate hearing that, it's that it's not true :p

    Tablet sales are shrinking, PC's aren't anymore.. They yieled to Tablets when they surged in mid 2010's, and to smarphones that fitted the needs of some, but have remained fairly stable for the last few yrs.

    Problem is, outside of sharing pics and videos to social media, Tablets, are useless. Mobile phones are more useless, but at least you can keep them in your pocket.
     
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  15. Zee

    Zee Member

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    Fair enough, and yeah, I'd agree there. Was a nice bonus "two for one" feature.

    We'll see re: emulation I guess. Only time will tell. I won't write it off altogether, but I do feel like Apple are really moving towards the iPad space, an dI would not be surprised to see a 15" iPad pro with some very impressive specs (and I mean significantly more so than now), along with an equally impressive price tag.

    That's not a bad thing, I mean, my only regret with my iPad Pro is not getting a 12.9" version, but such is. My next one will be the largest screen available at the time.

    I'd just like to see a little more freedom with the folder structure. I find it odd that I can create a folder in the "Files" section - EG - *App name*/files/specific project name, and yet, when I am trying to save a project in the respective app, it own't see the "specific project name" folder that I am trying to save to, it's annoying as hell. It means I end up having to save everything in Dropbox to keep files organised - which is a PITA when I have no net access (which is fairly frequent under Regular Normalâ„¢, and will be even more so once we get back to it.

    One of the reasons for running Bootcamp on my Air - it's hardly a powerhouse, but does perform really nicely under Windows - suitable for my current needs, anyway. My desktop is the beast, and if I really need to, I'll use it to crunch some stuff for work. It's a bit long in the tooth now, though still capable, though no upgrades until the new video cards are released (RTX3080Ti or whatever it will be), along with a fresh shiny pointy end mobo and CPU. I still enjoy rolling my own desktops, and kinda hoping to get my daughter into it, even if it's just a once off.


    Z...
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2020
  16. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Do you have data to back that up? I'm certainly not trying to pick a fight here, it's just every bit of sales data I find says that PC sales are in a gradual decline.

    If there's data to contradict that, I'd genuinely love to see it. I find the ever declining computer literacy of our planet greatly disturbing, and hope to see that turning back into an upward trend as it did in the early 2000s.

    Zero disagreement from me. I've long said that computer users are either producers or consumers, and tablets and phones are consumption devices, not production devices. (Perhaps there are a few tasks they can do adequately outside of mimicking a desktop, but the exception does not make the rule).

    But that's precisely the problem. So many people now are not producers of information. Even in the workplace, so many computer users are not much more than digital paper shufflers.

    I look at my own kids' peer group, and they're hopeless. Most can barely drive a computer interface, let alone perform basic installs or online tasks that are standard for my kids, and were standard for me at their age. I'm quite genuinely concerned for the future of our species who are so hopelessly dependent on computers, but so poorly skilled in their use.
     
  17. holdennutta

    holdennutta Member

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    Not much different from cars. Back in my father's generation it was expected you'd do at least basic maintenance. Now most new cars aren't designed to allow much more than topping up oil if a light turns on or adding windscreen washing fluid. However there's people skilled in maintaining them at dealerships (or at least allegedly skilled in my experience) and the world carries on quite happily. I see no reason computers won't go down this path.
     
  18. flu!d

    flu!d Never perfect, always genuine

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    I think PC sales are in decline, although I don't agree the PC is dead as there are simply things you cannot do on a tablet that you can do on a PC (although DeX comes close) ;)

    However, more to the point, I think tablets have dropped in favor of phablets - Basically phones have become so damn big that people don't see the need to own a phone and a tablet anymore.

    I'm surprised you've got the HDD space Zee, you must have lashed out on that Air when you bought it! I haven't come across one yet that could dual boot Windows/MacOS with any real usability.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 30, 2020
  19. Zee

    Zee Member

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    I got the 256GB version, I don't have much space on the WIndows partition - maybe 80GB. I only really use it to program Lutron lighting and RTI control systems. I did have a few more things on there, for a while, but that's what I need for now. Not particularly heavy.

    Z...
     
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  20. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    I can't see the comparison. A car is a method of transport. That in itself becoming more and more automated as time goes on. Not to mention the combustion engine is headed into rapid decline very soon.

    The difference with computers is that the complexity of the tasks we do continues to grow exponentially (versus cars whose role has changed little compared to either computers or other methods of transport and logistics). Look at
    finance, engineering, research, medicine - all of these require not only ever growing computer performance, but more competent users than ever. A big chunk of a current contract of mine is training a group of quite brilliant research scientists to use very complex clustered computer resources. They're working on tools that monitor weather, soil and vegetation from space that helps farmers grow critical crops that put food on our tables and clothes on our backs. They're looking at fire and flood prediction to avoid disasters like the ones we suffered here in Australia in the last 12 months. They're doing medical research for both humans and farm animals critical to battling new and old diseases (including COVID19). They're doing climate science to try and help out country escape from an archaic reliance on fossil fuels. None of this happens on tablets and phones. None of it happens on MacBooks either. But they do happen on tools and systems we're not teaching our kids in schools, but quite easily could, because ironically the software is all free. (And they're the same tools used in finance, business intelligence, analytics, data science, marketing, and a host of other industries, so the skills transfer easily).

    And the bigger irony is they're desperate for competent people (not just research scientists, but everywhere across the group, all of which requires computer competency), despite record high unemployment.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2020

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