Broadband a Third World joke...

Discussion in 'Networking, Telephony & Internet' started by corefreak, Oct 20, 2007.

  1. Szemen

    Szemen Member

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    I'm thinking why people in japan have unlimited 100mbits download is most of them can't read english. So most sites browsed are local websites, lessening the cost. Also, they are close to most asian large cities as well.

    I dunno..i just pulled that out of my ass :p
     
  2. Iceman

    Iceman Member

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    You know.. you've quoted the person who answered that very question in the very thread he answered it in..

    When you return to your high school on Monday; demand that they educate how to live in this world without being utterly spoon fed, until you do so I strongly suggest you stop flaunting your ignorance and try reading a bit.
     
  3. orgone500

    orgone500 Member

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    Good points Drunkmunky, but there are some subtle differences with the G9 proposal. The difference is the G9 are happy to wholesale "their" network, and have stated so.

    http://www.smh.com.au/news/business...a-in-tight-spot/2007/04/22/1177180480600.html

    Still, pinching Telstra copper is not ideal for a Telstra fanboy such as Wilf. Especially when Telstra could wholesale their current network and increase their share price if they wanted to. Surely more customers using a network has to be a good thing.

    The liberal proposal on the other hand takes the other approach of overbuilding the entire Telstra fibre network again, and tack on some wi-max hot spots at a huge cost to tax payers which will then be owned by Opel.
    This also ignores the fact that there are wireless providers already in some rural towns who are going to get steam rollered by the "subsidied" Opel deal.

    I personally think wimax is not really a winner in rural towns anyway, as adsl2 would suit most rural towns where the businesses (the ones who actually make money from faster internet services) are usually within 5 kms of the exchange

    Surely this duplication isn't going to benefit Telstra shareholders when the backhaul Telstra already has in the ground is suddenly made cheaper by a competitor willing to wholesale, plus when optus starts using this subsidied network for linking its mobile phone towers this will make mobile data cheaper hurting Testra again.

    Telstra is withholding ADSL2 services from any exchange that does not already have a competitor offering adsl2.

    Telstra has fibre in the ground linking all exchanges that could easily handle the near future broadband needs but refuses to wholesale at a reasonable price.

    http://www.internode.on.net/about/news/20050323-ruralbb-detail.htm

    As I have already stated, splitting Telstra into wholesale and retail is the only way to stop this wasting of tax payers money on stupid stop gap solutions and to give future governments the abilty to actually do something when they wake up to the fact that we are getting left behind. Telstra is currently holding a gun to the governments head, which is no good for anyone...
     
  4. Drunkmunky

    Drunkmunky Member

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    I agree this thread shouldn't slip to pure Telstra sledging, I'm not against Telstra entirely I just don't like Wilf's vehement defense of them as if they are completely blameless. Another point to note is that Telstra were invited to be a part of G9 but refused and now they are kicking up a stink that things aren't going their way.
     
  5. Wilf

    Wilf (Banned or Deleted)

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    as opposed to your continual whining about them, you apparently do not like your bullshit pointed out to you!

    of course they refused, all G9 wanted was Telstra's network and customers, there was nothing at all in the G9 to benefit Telstra!

    You forget, Telstra does not need the G9, but the G9 needs Telstra!

    Still wrong, they are kicking up a stink as the G9 just wants to take Telstra's customers and disconnect Telstra's copper network from Telstra exchanges, without paying the owners any compensation!!



    But a private company taking another private companies assets is alright for a Telstra basher/whiner like you......

    Except that they do....

    as they do not want to be forced top sell it very cheaply...

    By reasonable you mean "cheaply to its competitors"

    and just who is going to compensate the current shareholders? That question keeps being avoided by the Telstra bashers/whiners here!
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2007
  6. banshee343

    banshee343 Member

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    Bit snippy but meh.

    Surely you would agree that some profit is better than no profit? Everyone knows telstra arent going to lose money if they wholesale it. Considering the port cost will sit above current 8mbit unless all the costs get dropped along the lines, thatd be one nice money maker.

    The ISPs want access, alot of people want access, telstra want money, telstra can make money selling access to ISPs who will then sell to people. Am i missing something?
     
  7. Wilf

    Wilf (Banned or Deleted)

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    Yes, why should the competition get access to Telstra's assets cheaply?

    Telstra can make more through retailing.
     
  8. Herbo

    Herbo Member

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    Man I'm sick of your shit.

    No benifit at all eh? Like getting part of the wholesale profits for the network? Helping improve the standard of Australia's internet?

    And hopefully they get their shit taken off them and are given nothing but a big FUCK YOU for doing nothing but trying to stiffle competition. Just so they can charge the fucking ridiculous prices they do for internet while investing nothing into improving infastructure in Australia.

    Boo fucking who. Telstra had their chance and as I said they've done nothing but try and stiffle competition and expansion so they can hold their monopoly on Australian internet and watch the unwarranted profits role in.

    Cheaply my fucking ass. Gee why is it then that when ISP's like Internode install their own ADSL2+ equipment into exchanges it becomes cheaper for the customer? Telstra charging too much even for ADSL1 perhaps?

    I really couldn't give a shit at this point. Telstra shares are plumeting enough without them having their infustructure stolen. Maybe stock holders should worry more about kicking Sol and his dirty scams the fuck out.
     
  9. Wilf

    Wilf (Banned or Deleted)

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    No shit, just facts - you are the one with the shit here

    Telstra is doing that on their own...

    Trying to stifle competion?

    Another lie from you, it is the competition that do not want to invest the money, prefering to get cheap access from telstra...

    you seem to think you saying it makes it true, it does not

    because they get cheap access to Telstra's power, airconditioning, floor space etc.

    of course not, as the company you work for will benefit!!

    You know you have lost it when you have to start swearing.
     
  10. dazzawul

    dazzawul Member

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    If theyre actually facts.. why dont you PROVIDE YOUR SOURCES!

    If this was an essay, no matter HOW WELL you argue your point, REGARDLESS of your truth\lack thereof, you would have failed.

    Regardless of what everyone else is saying, PROVE IT, dont ask them to do so, take the initiative, you KNOW youre right dont you? :lol:

    It shouldnt be THAT hard to provide a decent source or two, because, wouldnt it help your cause, to show ALL OF THESE PEOPLE whats going on and give them something irrefutable? should it..? :confused:

    cheers lads
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2007
  11. Herbo

    Herbo Member

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    How exactly are they improving Australian internet? You know installing ADSL2+ in all their exchanges doesn't count for shit if they don't actually turn it on and make it available to anyone. Or perhaps you're talking about the artificial limit Telstra put on ADSL1, limiting it 1.5mpbs for years for no reason, feeding us bullshit like it wasn't possible. Then after what, a year or two after their competitors have been offering ADSL2+ where they could afford to install it around Australia, Telstra decides to take their artificial limit off ADSL1! They even start offering ADSL2+ services. ZOMG! Yay for Australia and thank god for Tesltra! :rolleyes:

    Oh you say it's a lie so it must be so! While I have no evidence to backup the fact that it is NOT cheap access, you know, apart from the fact that the ACCC deemed it to be fair, YOU have not a scrap of proof to prove that it is too cheap. All you are going on is Telstra's word, which, if you read the above history of Tesltra and Australian internet, doesn't seem to count for much.

    Not so says the ACCC. But what would they know. They don't have any experts on the matter, they just write random numbers on paper close their eyes and wherever their finger lands on the paper is the new value!

    I started swearing because I want to abuse the shit out of you but last time I abused someone on these forums it was to someone in another Telstra thread and that pussy got me banned for a day.
     
  12. Wilf

    Wilf (Banned or Deleted)

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    I have, including ACCC documents, but the anti Telstra trolls refuse to look at them.

    But you ignore the fact that the anti Telstra bashers/whiners are unable to provide anything....
     
  13. orgone500

    orgone500 Member

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    http://www.internode.on.net/about/news/20050323-ruralbb-detail.htm

    When it's cheaper for an ISP to build an entirely seperate network than it is to buy backhaul from Telstra, it's hardly cheap. The company I work for also built its own short range link as Telstra wanted more for 1 years worth of data than the cost of building a new link. Using your philosophy, every trucking country in Australia should build its own highways, even though there is already a road with capacity there. "But its Telstra's road" I hear you moan. The fact is it shouldn't be.
     
  14. Wilf

    Wilf (Banned or Deleted)

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  15. banshee343

    banshee343 Member

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    I dont see how retailing to say 10,000 people making $60 is better than retailing to 150,000 people making $30 each, or even $10 each. Please explain.

    Remember, if they dont wholesale they have a limited area. Anyone with half a mind would choose a competitor. If they opened it up they could tap into every single clueless mum, dad, granny and granddad. Do the math, i have. $60,000 is less than $150,000-$450,000.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2007
  16. dazzawul

    dazzawul Member

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    Wilf you linked to the accc page on the FTTN proposal but that was it (reading through it now btw)

    but as several people have linked (and then explained, and then linked to again, that internode article) telstra makes it economically unfeasible for anyone to compete with them, its cheaper to run your own hardware, doubling up on the stuff thats already there..

    ACTUALLY, the telstra documents are outright lying from the start...

    The whole idea is to replace telstras hardware (AND everyone elses...), with faster hardware... which somehow degrades services...

    Fearmongering at best.

    Now, I think we all remember that that was the MAXIMUM telstra could possibly sustain in australia for the longest time (and even then had a hard time delivering that) and now suddenly they can offer 8 on the same hardware :o
    As well as the whole, many people having far too much line noise to get much past 256 k (or even not at all >=-\)
    Not to mention all of the people stuck behind RIMs (like CGheaven for example)
    to promise what telstra used to consider 'high end' as a BARE MINIMUM OF SERVICE is HARDLY cheating anybody, or at all a mediocre attempt at replacing the communications setup, then it goes on to mention that buisness customers somehow get cheated by being put on a "residential-centric 'best efforts' service".

    Oh LAWL, they poo poo'ed the "homebrew pricing structure" where, from what I understand of the G9 proposale, basically amounts to *what youre using* rather than *the highest telstra tells us they want, that the ACCC wont bury*

    THAT and the entire thing basically assumes that the G9s planned network will be run by a collaboration of the other retail guys, rather than as a completely seperate entity... so what theyre saying is "people will lose out if they do this, cause they'll end up with what we have, and we cannot have that! >=-\"

    I think wilf has been taken in by telstras propaganda a little too much...

    The entire thing is basically telstra BAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWING about the copper network being redesigned to be a system that more fairly supports competitors, with the end result of them losing the network that the govt built.

    Ill admit that even though it was built with taxpayer funded money, they did end up paying it back, which they havent upgraded, and they were GOING TO REPLACE IT ANYWAYS, WITH SOMETHING SIMILAR TO THE G9 PROPOSAL!

    Which is kinda funny.. cause they complain that the G9 proposal will bring in a monopoly for whoever runs it... but they want to build THE EXACT SAME THING, theyre being a bunch of (idiots), and the telstra replies on the ACCC page read like angry rants, essentially saying "NO! THIS IS BAD!" despite being better than their current service :rolleyes:

    this is rediculous, Wilf, youre either trolling like your manhood depends on it, or you have a vested interest in telstras well doing (shareholder, works for the company, ect).

    thats all I have to say, cheers lads.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2007
  17. g@z

    g@z Member

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    This all reminds me of a religious argument.

    Person "I believe in God"

    Other person "God does not exist"

    Person "There is no proof he does not exist"

    Other person "There is no proof he does. All the stories about Jesus and God are flawed"

    Person "So you can't prove he does not exist, so therefore he must exist"

    Repeat a few times.

    Repeat a few more times with abuse.

    Start claiming that becuase they used abuse, you must be right, forgetting that you have done the same.

    One side realises not matter how many reasonable valid arguments or facts you put forward, the other person just does not want to change their minds and so drops the conversation.

    Other side takes the silence as some sort of proof they are right.

    Wait a few months.

    Repeat.

    Regards,
    g@z.
     
  18. orgone500

    orgone500 Member

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    God exists in NZ.

    http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22655173-643,00.html

    "TELECOM New Zealand's freshly installed chief has kickstarted his tenure with a plan to spend $NZ1.4 billion ($1.16 billion) on a national broadband network."

    "Mr Reynolds' appointment has already produced a thaw in the tense relationship between TNZ and the Government, and stands in stark contrast to the pitched battle between Telstra and the Australian Government. "

    Sounds like a dose of something Australia could well do with...
     
  19. Herbo

    Herbo Member

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  20. g@z

    g@z Member

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    Based on that main story, Sol should be sacked and deported. What a cu^t.

    Regards,
    g@z.
     

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