[PROJECT] Builds By Baz - Full Scale MK II Colonial Viper

EDIT: Feb2021

Frequently Asked Questions.

I welcome and encourage questions and am thrilled to have you all along for the journey. This build log is long, so folks often miss the questions that have been answered several times.
Here are some FAQs to help save both your time and mine. I'll sticky/pin this to the top of the page.
*Please consider your questions and be respectful.
I've been at this for years and have thought it through carefully. Safety is my key concern. Where strength/stability issues are of concern, I have over-engineered to be sure. I have a long background with freight , (road, air and sea) and construction of all kinds.
Your questions are valuable and get me thinking outside the box. They do help! Keep 'em comin'!
Please note, this is the 2003 version, MkII colonial Viper.
It is NOT the 1978 version, MkI. It does not have lasers, turbo-boost, nor motor bikes in the belly.
Q - Why are you building some parts movie-accurate, while other things seem to have a lot of creative licence?
A - I am taking some artistic licence with the engines. An X-Wing fighter on display at a local shopping centre, made me realise that static displays can be boring. Its size was imposing and it looked great from a distance, but up close it was a bit basic. My engines and the entire ship will be multi-layered with light, sound and motion. That's the way I want it.
Q - What is it made of?
A - The frame is steel under plywood formers, spaced apart to give shape and proportion.
The shell is recycled polystyrene, sanded and shaped to support the fibreglass skin. The resin is polystyrene-friendly.
Q - How are you going to fit it out of your shed?
A - On 3X heavy-duty steel framed dollys, each rated at 800kg SWS.
The wings are removable, so there's plenty of room to get it out of the workshop and into a trailer.
Q - How much does it weigh?
As of 02 March 2022, 755kg. When complete it will be nearly 1000kg.
Q - That sounds heavy. Won't it be difficult to move?
A - No. Employment of tools such as ropes, chains, winches, chocks, block and tackle are but a few at my disposal.
Q - How many hours have you spent on the Viper?
A - I don't keep a log. As of September 2022, it's been a few years. Ask me again in 12 months.
Q - How do you do it? You seem to have so much time on your hands.
A - I get this a lot. I have a job and three kids. I have little spare time. But what is spare time? It's any time that you could use productively, that you are likely not using as best you could. Playing a PC game? Watching a TV show? Sleeping more than you need to? I wait until everyone else has gone to bed, then go to my shed and create. I do quiet stuff at night and set up in preparation for coming home and smashing in with the tools - all the noisy stuff for brief periods. I steal away every five minutes I can get. THAT's how I manage to fit more in my day. I hate laziness, boredom and unproductivity.
Q - How do you have so much patience?
A - I don't. I lose my temper all the time. Last time my wireless router gave me trouble, I took it out on the garden bed and drove an eight foot steel picket through it's heart. I have no time for shit not doing it's job. What I do have is determination and focus. Big difference.
Q - Is it going to fly?
A - No.
Q - Why 30mm cannons? Bullets don't work in space.
A - Yes they do.
Q - isn't it stupid to have jet turbines and intakes in space?
A - the creators employed more realistic design for this one, using newtonian physics in spaceflight and secondary jet propulsion and aerodynamics within atmosphere.
Q - Why does a spacecraft have wings and altimeters?
A - Same reason the NASA space shuttles had them. See previous question and answer.
Q - What are you going to skin it with? Won't fibreglass melt the polystyrene?
A - I used fibreglass mat, but instead of resin I used a product called botecote, which is polystyrene friendly.
Q - What are you using to power the engines?
A - An industrial BBQ rotisserie, hooked up to chopped down bicycle gearing, via home made drive shafts, pulleys and belts.
Q - What are you going to do with it, when it's finished?
A - It will go to events and exhibitions like Comicon/Supanova, air shows, etc. Occasional children's charity fundraisers at my discretion.
A custom trailer will be built, to store, transport and display it.
Q - Are you going to make it into a flight simulator?
A - No.
Q - What did it cost you to make it?
A - Money? No idea. Lots. Time? Years. Blood? Yep, a bit. Lost sleep? Lots. Unhealthy balance of work/family/relaxation? No more or less than the million other hobbies humans have.
Q - You must have spent a fortune, how are you going to make money off it? Is it worth it?
A - Many people have hobbies that cost money, yet bring joy. It's not about money.
Q - Can you share the plans/blueprints?
A - No. I am under a non-disclosure agreement with my CAD operator, as I am with certain people who have given me access to exclusive reference material. I will honour this agreement.
If you want to make something similar, you will have to use a 3D model, solidify it, then chop it up to make your replica.
Q - When are you going to make a Cylon Raider? Or a launch tube? Or a hangar deck?
A - I'm not, but you certainly can!
There are more, but I can't remember them right now. I will add them as I do.
Luv, Baz.


EDIT: 13Aug2017: The secret is out! Oculi guessed it! Go to page four for the first pics of the build revealed

EDIT-4Aug2017: I will change the name of this thread when I am ready to reveal what I'm up to.

I was going to keep it a secret until finished, then reveal the completed project along with the story of how it came to be. However, from my previous builds I have found a lot of people have enjoyed following along as I fail, succeed, learn, experiment and involve everyone.

So, rather than talk talk talk about what I'm "gunna" do, I think that once I've got to a certain stage and something to show, I will bring it out and share the work in progress as before.



Original post:

Hey gang. With Iron Man project all but done, (now just tweaks before getting it into kids hospitals), I am ready to start moving on with a project I've been planning a couple of years.

This one is just for fun and once I get going I will reveal it for all those who want to follow along.

Before we get to that, I need a little help.


I need a *volunteer, skilled CAD 3D operator. EDIT: I have found 2 Volunteers/
The last two 3D CAD designers who volunteered to help me have fallen through after months of planning and waiting. I totally get it that people have lives and that's just the way it goes.

However, I can't start this project without accurate cross-sections of a physical scaled model.

I have photographs of the model from every angle, to be loaded into a 3D CAD generator, from which vertical cross-section, profile slices can be taken at intervals along the length of the model, then drawings with dimensions of each slice and distance between slices produced. This will help me form the basic shell, (shape) and I will be scratch-building all the details from there.

The object is 30cm long, but in order for me to reproduce it to its full scale of nearly nine metres long and keep proportions, I MUST have accurate shop drawings.

I appreciate CAD is tedious, skilled and time-consuming so please, if anyone would want to help me, I will return the favour in some way if I can. *Perhaps I can make a knife for you?

Up front, I require open and regular communications. Often at night. I can be a pain in the butt and sometimes pushy, but most of you already know that.


This will be an epic project that will amaze all. There is no mission this time. It's just for fun and just because I can.

 

A working model of the Enterprise, with seating for 8 and actual warp drive?

 

I might be able to borrow a handheld 3d scanner for a weekend.

I have the CAD skills but probably not the time unfortunately. Good luck!

 

Thus has been my problem so far. Those who have stepped up have not had the time and have dropped off the radar.

 

Very curious as to what you have got plan now. Is it related to the post a while back where you asked about scaling something from a 2D model?

 

Ask Agg if he can put a call out on the News page.

 

So first step is you need a 3d model of a physical object correct? Is it only photos you have? are there reference point measurements included ? Is the object something you have physical access to? or can get 3d scanned?
Does the 3d model need to be 3d printable? is it organic or mechanical? does it have moving parts requiring rigging, does it have to have parts with tight accuracy tolerances, does it need texturing?

These are all considerations and will effect how to even start the modelling. Modelling for rendering/gaming/printing are ALL different and hard to convert/interchange. So one person might get 75% and find all their work useless to your needs.

Also clients "scope creeping" will kill even a well paying job so have a well defined requirements document up front since you cant really pay here. So have everything well defined up front, be available to answer questions but otherwise stay out the way. If you can't, or it turns out wrong, you didn't define requirements properly.


I don't have my client info sheet at hand as I stopped 3D work a decade ago, but the above is the general gist. The more info you can provide up front the more chance you have of attracting help from someone with the right skills. "3D" covers hundreds of specialised differing skillsets. OK so you might have IP concerns over stating the item/project up front but the more info you can provide the better. Some people only deal with characters, or buildings, or vehicles, or scifi stuff and the right person could do the job in an hour while others will struggle for two weeks. Myself I specialised in accurate technical true CAD modelling, done little photomodelling but not for years (modelling from photo sets) but the thought of modelling your newborn for a peeing animation scares the hell out of me.

 

Thanks heaps for the insight.

Yes, I'm being cautious publicly until someone puts their hand up. I currently have one person who has just stepped up in the last few days since posting this and I have divulged the exact nature of what is required. He's going to have a go, based on information I have provided.

Totally agree with this mate. Spot on!

To give away a bit of an example without giving away the project, lets use a plastic model kit as an example.

Airplaines and cars, tanks, and many other vehicles come in plastic model kits at scales of 1/72, 1/32, 1/144 etc, whatever.

To accurately replicate one of these objects to full 1:1 size (just the outer shell shape) and you have no technical or shop drawings, (believe me I've searched for a couple of years) is challenging.

If said object is 1-32 scale and you take vernier caliper measurements from it, then multiply your measurement by 32, then even if you are 0.5mm out, you are magnifying that mistake by 32.

Variable mistakes like that all over your 1:1 project, would mean terrible issues with proportion and alignment, wastage of materials etc. Especially when your object is getting up around the ten metre mark.

I have already built one model of the object using vernier measurements and multiplying by 3. The 3X end result looks ok, but already you can see the inaccuracies in it. I'd hate to imagine what it would look like full size ten times that.

So, my best solution is to generate a 3D model from the object in hand, then slice it up into cross-sections along it's length, to generate diagrams of each cross section, (vertical slice) with accurate measurements to plot out and cut each slice.

The slices then need to be cut to full size, let's say in plywood, spaced apart down the length of the project then filled and skinned to produce the overall shape. The shape has geometric shapes, compound curves, straights, hollows and angles.

Texture and details are not required as I will be cutting holes, scratch-building details and moving parts, then painting/finishing that stuff freehand afterwards.

I don't have access to a 3D scanner, nor any knowledge of how to use one or if it would suit my needs. What I do have is high resolution photographs of the object, taken from above 45degrees , level and below 45 degrees, rotated 360 degrees for each aspect against a plain backdrop with consistent lighting.

Camera was placed on a tripod at a nominal distance to minimise distortion and the object was placed on a rotating post, photographing every few degrees of rotation.

I can provide reference measurements of length and such of both the object I have and the length is it supposed to be.

There are already a couple of electronic 3D models CAD/Renders out there online that I have recently discovered, however I am not expert in these things and don't know if they can be sliced up as I have specified above.

Does that make sense?

Baz.

 

Most 3D scanners will produce a 'point cloud', which is just a bunch of points on the surface of the model. Converting them in to a surface or solid model is another step that can be mostly automated, but still requires significant input.

What you're talking about (3D model from photographs) is called photogrammetry, and again, results can vary wildly based on the features / capability of the software and the skill of the operator.

Can you do a similar set of photographs on another not so secret object, and post them somewhere so that people can see if their software / skills are up to the task?

 

Interesting to know. Thanks mate.

I'm sort of into it with this bloke, but we will see how we go for a bit.

 

Hey gang, I have some .LWO files and need to know what software opens it and if anyone has the software, or can provide a link to it free somewhere?

Or if anyone knows of a way to reliably convert the format to something compatible with autocad.

 

That's a lightwave file. I think I could open it in 3dsmax as convert it to step or iges (more common interchange formats)

 

Alternatively blender should be able to open / view / convert lwo files

Be warned though, the blender ui sucks

 

Thanks very much! Seems to be working.

 

Im not the best at 3d drawings but i can do a decent enough job for my cnc router so I'm happy to volunteer whatever help i can give, even if you just need to bounce ideas off someone or tidy up some drawings, but doing a full scale CAD from just photos will be a challenge and may take some time.

It sounds like you want something like a CT scan done on the object and you still have the object.

If I were you I would touch base with a local makerspace that has a 3d scanner and see if they can help you out in trade for an Iron Man suit show and tell. eg https://www.makehackvoid.com/our-space/ in Giralang (I have no idea if that is anywhere near you)

 

Thanks mate. Yes, that place is on the other side of town, but only 1/2 hour away. Good to know.

So far my guy has found a couple of 3D CAD models online, just playing around now and sorting out software to see if he can slice it up and spit out some cross-sections for me to start cutting.

Hopefully, we won't even need to use the photos of my model.

I think what I'll do, is wait until I start making some decent headway with the build, then reveal all so you wonderful folks can enjoy the WIP.

Not much point until then. I hate procrastination so I'll show what I am doing, not what I'm going to do.

Baz.

 

Is there an open book on what you're up to? Guessing could be fun.

God I hope you're making a 9m long Star Destroyer.

 

Don't we all!

 

Might be fun...

I have two CAD operators on the case now. Should be close to some shop drawings so I can get started. In the meantime I have build a workspace, jig and accumulated a ton and a half of material to get started.

 

I think/hope it's a big boat