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Can we bypass the government net filter? *Contains scanned letter from Conroy*

Discussion in 'Networking, Telephony & Internet' started by caironet16, Dec 23, 2008.

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  1. FiShy

    FiShy Member

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    no its not like a vpn.... just read the damn pdf.
     
  2. OP
    OP
    caironet16

    caironet16 Member

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    k done trying to explain this to you, lol.
     
  3. FiShy

    FiShy Member

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    Did you read the pdf?

    http://www.caida.org/publications/papers/2004/p2p-layerid/p2p-layerid.pdf

    Detecting BT can and is done by detecting the flow of the traffic, not reading the payload. So using two way encryption does not change the flow, just the payload.

    Ie

    BT traffic flow, encrypted or not.
    Code:
    [HOST A]  <--ISP--> [HOST 1]
    [HOST A]  <--ISP--> [HOST 2]
    [HOST A]  <--ISP--> [HOST 3]
    [HOST A]  <--ISP--> [HOST 4]
    [HOST A]  <--ISP--> [HOST 5]
    [HOST A]  <--ISP--> [HOST 6]
    

    Using IPsec or VPN establishing one connection/tunnel/bitstream to the destination, then the p2p connections go out from there.

    BT traffic flow via IPSec/VPN

    Code:
                 VPN
    [HOST A]  (<--ISP-->) [HOST B ] <--ISP2--> [HOST 1]
                          [HOST B ] <--ISP2--> [HOST 2]
                          [HOST B ] <--ISP2--> [HOST 3]
                          [HOST B ] <--ISP2--> [HOST 4]
                          [HOST B ] <--ISP2--> [HOST 5]
                          [HOST B ] <--ISP2--> [HOST 6]
    
    In this case the equpiment at ISP see ones established connection to one host, this does not flag as p2p.
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2008
  4. mordy

    mordy Member

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    I've also heard that wishful thinking can do this successfully. Or atleast thats what stephen conroy reckons.
     
  5. -=N0N@ME420=-

    -=N0N@ME420=- Member

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    I don't understand how both howard and rudd have retarded people at the head of IT. I mean is there nobody into politics who has half a clue about what they're talking about?
     
  6. SLATYE

    SLATYE SLATYE, not SLAYTE

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    Well, realistically it doesn't have to do much at all.

    The people who build it just have to say that it'll do all of that stuff (and that further improvements are impossible, due to the laws of physics). If they say that, it'll keep Conroy happy even if the filter doesn't actually block anything. No doubt the ISPs will fully agree that it's working perfectly, because they're very happy to use a filter that lets everything through.
     
  7. Mshake

    Mshake Member

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    seedbox or dedicated.....
     
  8. crazyelf

    crazyelf Member

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    you could always purchase a vpn tunnel service from another non filtered country? annoying but i guess if you have a fairly decent router it could connect to it automatically
     
  9. infirmus

    infirmus Member

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    You are an idiot. Fishy is 100% correct. I know my ISP Exetel shapes encrypted BT traffic.
     
  10. OP
    OP
    caironet16

    caironet16 Member

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    We're talking about filtering bit torrent, not shaping or blocking.

    It amazes me that you can call someone you don't even know an idiot 2 hours away from christmas.

    This must be that christmas cheer you hear about.

    I guess thats why I'm an atheist.
     
  11. JohnnoD

    JohnnoD Member

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    Abuse? On an internet forum? I'm totally new to this, I was stunned!

    Go have a drink and enjoy your last few hours of sanity before Christmas hell breaks loose

     
  12. FiShy

    FiShy Member

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    im talking about shaping and blocking, i stated that all along.
     
  13. SLATYE

    SLATYE SLATYE, not SLAYTE

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    Filtering torrent data to prevent it being used for illegal transfers is implausible, as I mentioned earlier. Even un-encrypted, the government can't possibly handle the sheer number of torrents, and it'd probably be a matter of hours before they got banned from most trackers. If they use TPB, they'll be breaking the usage policy, which will result in a 5000 Euro fee for the Australian government plus bandwidth and miscellaneous other costs.

    Therefore the only option is to block BT outright, regardless of content. As FiShy has stated, they can certainly manage this even if the content is encrypted. However, it's still not practical - too many things depend on P2P.
     
  14. wwwww

    wwwww Member

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    Remote desktop

    problem solved
     
  15. scruff

    scruff RIP

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    Ya, very true this. I can then imagine it turning in to "we must block all videos via P2P! There are child porn .avi's" or some such. There's a lot of media providers looking into p2p streaming for live / pay per view events, which is a great example of legit P2P video. They did it with Eurovision this year using Octostream, and FIFA were looking in to it.


    The scary part about this whole thing is what could happen if it gets implemented effectively, and then places like the MPAA and AFACT start petitioning the government to use it to prevent copyright infringement, and then googling "family guy" or something lands you in jail :thumbdn:
     
  16. mordy

    mordy Member

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    well thats completely unacceptable to everyone who has a clue

    theyre slowing down the internet by orders of magnitude, and blocking millions of wrong pages daily(i think 1-8% of false positives depending on the implementation).

    But when you factor in the complexities it just becomes a huge ball of crap. Lets look at what conroy has promised, a dual list filter. The first list is blocked to everyone, and another list (which will be absolutely massive) will have to both lookup the site, and also the membership details of the person requesting the page to ascertain if they have opted out or not. Additionally this server will need to be able to reconstruct the http sessions on the fly incase urls are split over multiple packets.

    Now it gets exciting, the filter will also monitor p2p sessions and figure out which file it downloading from, and its contents. This sort of function is barely technically possible with a single user downloading a single torrent using very cpu intensive deep packet inspection software. Theres no way it could keep track of millions of users downloading millions of files.

    Not to mention if they did ever set up the servers needed for such a operation, you would just need to set your p2p to only use encrypted sessions and would bypass it completely.

    So in conclusion
    blocking child pornography sites:
    - child pornographers dont and havent used insecure http forever
    - filter lists have downfalls, and bypasses
    the clean feed:
    - with a list that large, and an opt-out ability, the systems would need to be supercomputers or we could see packet transfer times rise into the seconds
    p2p filtering:
    - would need even more extensive servers, which would probably just crash under the strain, right b4 ppl turn on encryption. After which they will be idle (what a waste of money)
     
  17. SLATYE

    SLATYE SLATYE, not SLAYTE

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    BBC's iPlayer uses P2P too. It's not available in Australia, but it seems to have been very successful - so other companies may well use similar technology.

    I'm not sure that it'd work like that. There's a really handy defence: "the filter would block anything illegal, so what I was doing must have been legal". Then it's a problem for the government.

    The filter aims to work so that people no longer have to be responsible for their actions. Previously parents had to be responsible for keeping an eye on their childrens' internet usage; now the government will do that. The side effect of this is that when people do something wrong, it's not their responsibility any more - because the government's chosen to take responsibility. If someone downloaded something illegally, the RIAA and MPAA are welcome to sue the responsible party: the Australian government.
     
  18. Recharge

    Recharge Member

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    yea, but try finding even a single cp active web site.. so what are they blocking exactly?
     
  19. jas0nt

    jas0nt Member

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    fuck it. i'll do it gladly. it'll be like buying condoms, there shouldn't be a shame in it.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2008
  20. jas0nt

    jas0nt Member

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    it doesn't piss you off you have to spend an extra $50 a month in seedbox and VPN fees just to bypass a stupid fucking idea?
     
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