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Concerns about Data Retention, Surveillance and Privacy

Discussion in 'Networking, Telephony & Internet' started by Agg, Jul 18, 2012.

  1. Vladdo

    Vladdo Member

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    As noted by someone on these forums recently, the police have the power to intercept and record pretty much anything you say & download anyway.. Thing is tho, whether that pertains to any crime that has or hasn't been committed is another thing..

    What disturbs me the most tho is that it's like having a stranger breaking into your house each and every day, having a snoop around, take whatever they like and leave, all without you ever knowing about it.. And then what happens to that gathered information? Who is monitoring the internet police? Do we really have to go back to hiding money in the matress or recording important information in the back of a notebook simply because we can't trust anyone to do the right thing anymore..

    Reform is the word that I like to use for 'closing loopholes'.. Does it benefit anyone but those on the other side of the fence? Not really. I can only hope that this already unstable govt is now promptly shown the door once people wake up to what's really going on..

    http://forums.overclockers.com.au/showthread.php?t=1025111
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
  2. IACSecurity

    IACSecurity Member

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    Don't be stupid, people won't read facts, they just want to join the sheeples and whine and complain about things they haven't even read, nor understood.



    Vladdo, they are allowed to 'break into your house and snoop around...." existing laws give them that powers to perform those acts physically at your premise.

    You may also like to try my 6 Step plan, its currently free for the next 100 callers.


    Really people, please read it yourself, stop going off the opinions of what other issue motivated parties provide. Everyone has their own angle, to present the proposals in a way that suits their own purpose (Govt. included). Read it and make up your own mind, not simply regurgitate crap other people write (myself included).
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
  3. meremortal

    meremortal Member

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    This bill is like wire-tapping every single person in Australia's phone/s and keeping every phone call recorded for 2 years.

    Guilty until proven innocent.

    An EXPENSIVE and pointless exercise to cater for the absolute minority of wrong doers.

    In the same vein let's record every phone call of every single person in Australia and keep it for 2 years.

    Let's also install a camera in every vehicle to monitor people's illegal use of mobile phones while driving.

    While we are at it lets put cameras in people's homes and video them in case they beat their kids or talk about terrorism.

    In fact I think the police should just start a city wide house by house inspection of every home in case they're up to no-good.

    Meh...

    And on another note all that data will be fantastic for the Russian hackers to get into.

    I'll be really happy to have all my credit card details and passwords stored conveniently in the one place for any script kiddy and up to poke around in.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
  4. IACSecurity

    IACSecurity Member

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    Step 1?

    Come on dude, just read it.

    How can you mount an effective attack on it, if your not even going to read it?

    I welcome people disputing it, as a democracy this shit should pass public scrutiny, and should be for the benefit of the people.

    What you guys are doing is just making noise so that valid arguments are lost in the quagmire. Your never going to change anything with that approach.
     
  5. Vladdo

    Vladdo Member

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    I did read the article and understood its contents.. but again, I regurgitate what I said previously..

    At least if the police did get a warrant to break into my house and do a search, you'd at least be aware that you're under surveillance and have knowledge of said crime. But to just randomly store whatever information you have online, without even some sort of notification is unjust. If I make contact a call centre, i'm told upfront.. 'this conversation may be monitored for training purposes..'.. Will the govt do the same for me? Right ;)

    Would that also mean that Gilliards personal email be stored? Hardly. Or anyone else that has powers to alter/reform the bill.. It's just another erosion of privacy where everyone else is the winner but the general populace..
     
  6. qwertylesh

    qwertylesh Member

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    Our ubiquitous ginger overlord of the pings leader knows whats best for us. All hail the leader
     
  7. IACSecurity

    IACSecurity Member

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    Really? Well that's great, you seem to be one of the few. Hopefully you have done Steps 3 and 4,5,6 too.

    FWIW, I think they need to tone down the proposal. What they want to do makes sense (from their perspective), what is needed is strong controls to prevent abuse, I think that is what it is lacking.

    It wont get those needed controls if people just spout crap and spam everyone with misinformed garbage.

    I'm just playing devils advocate and entertaining myself :) Thus far arguments have been pretty sad.

    BTW Gillards email should be stored under existing archive legislation :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
  8. FiShy

    FiShy Member

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  9. Vladdo

    Vladdo Member

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    To me, that's the whole issue.. What controls are there that it won't be abused..

    I think it's better to just not go down that road whatsoever. Don't open that can of worms to weed out a few undesirables ..
     
  10. meremortal

    meremortal Member

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    You mean the Discussion Paper here?

    http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary...atives_Committees?url=pjcis/nsl2012/index.htm

    I've read a lot of it skim reading.

    I find it offensive on many levels and everything I've said stands.

    Fine to streamline ASIO's/Fed police procedures but "listening in" to every conversation and text message searching for "baddies" which is essentially what this all comes down in the name of "protection from terrorism" is a joke.

    If this comes through the information that is retained will be abused to the benefit of those that hold the information.

    The data will be sold to the highest bidder. It will be used in all sorts of underhanded ways. It will be compromised and used incorrectly. It's the human way.

    Just think of the secrets that could be used for profit and blackmail.

    Have you actually looked at the statistics of terrorist deaths?

    Funding hospitals and better nutrition has a MUCH great benefit on "national security" and welfare.

    My belief is that this is about control and tax evasion and has almost nothing to do with the scary boogeymen.

    Data matching and search algorithms will be run on all the data looking for everything (99% of which will be wrong) I guarantee it.

    It's 100% wrong AND a massive waste of money ESPECIALLY because those that want to hide will instantly and effectively hide from it so it will only be another massively expensive mechanism for "controlling" the masses.
     
  11. Vladdo

    Vladdo Member

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    That's it in a nutshell.. The temptation to use that data for means other than security would just be too great.

    "... Oh yeah.. we have all that data.. statistics.. it's just sitting there.. unused.. why don't we use it for some other purpose.."

    It's just another rabbit hole.. the original purpose will morph into something else..
     
  12. coderx

    coderx Member

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    my suggestion to people : Linux - VPN (encrypted) - Encrypted drives. and darknet.
     
  13. IACSecurity

    IACSecurity Member

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    Skim reading doesn't count, you miss the improtant info.

    ^ you haven't read it either have you?
     
  14. FiShy

    FiShy Member

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    I prefer to surf the net with the light on, to creepy in the dark.
     
  15. meremortal

    meremortal Member

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    What important info? Please enlighten us.
     
  16. IACSecurity

    IACSecurity Member

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    You read it, why take my trolly word for it?

    What I think is important you may not, and vice versa. If this is something you are clearly pashionate about, why don't you take the time to fully understand the implications you can better argue against it?





    Fishy, I use Sneakernet, though it can be smelly at times...
     
  17. FiShy

    FiShy Member

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    I read it, seems tinfoil hats still work.



    but for how long????????


    :Paranoid:



    I like how no one has talked about the good stuff in there, like the whole obligation to harden networks.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
  18. meremortal

    meremortal Member

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    Ahhhhh I think you may be a giant troll.

    I've read enough to understand the implications and I have given my account.

    You are at this stage the only person I can see in support of these measures in this entire thread of which maybe 30 people have commented which means you are either insane, a troll or benefit directly from these measures.

    Only someone who is extremely naive, or young, or both would support these measures.

    Or evil. Very very evil.

    Here's a start...as a measure of good will why not put your full name, phone number, credit card details and address here for this thread to Store. We'll keep it safe and nothing bad will happen a result. :lol:
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
  19. coderx

    coderx Member

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    that article was from news.com.au <- A highly "reputable" source *cough*

    Any thing that gives the government more power over people private interactions is a bad thing.

    Democracy is when a government fears the people, tyranny is when the people fear the government.

    For highly tech savvy people this doesn't pose a threat, and probably never will. For everyone else it is a problem.
     
  20. IACSecurity

    IACSecurity Member

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    You really don't understand the document, or anything I have written do you?
    I am also not 'supporting' the document, I just said there is stuff that needs changing. Your arguing against the doc, but have not even udnerstood it, and use childish "aaaaaah my data" arguments.

    I will say again, if you want to be effective in defeating or changing the proposal, get your arguments, and udnerstanding lined up first.
     

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