1. OCAU Merchandise now available! Check out our 20th Anniversary Mugs, Classic Logo Shirts and much more! Discussion here.
    Dismiss Notice

Consolidated Business & Enterprise Computing Rant Thread

Discussion in 'Business & Enterprise Computing' started by elvis, Jul 1, 2008.

  1. NSanity

    NSanity Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2002
    Messages:
    18,104
    Location:
    Canberra
  2. bcann

    bcann Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2006
    Messages:
    5,963
    Location:
    NSW
    that's all well and good but PDF's tend to be the end product that is unalterable for most people. for day to day stuff, its still a word document until its finalised and released, then its PDF.
     
  3. mr_death44

    mr_death44 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2005
    Messages:
    366
    Location:
    Melbourne
    I agree, and at this point we're not looking at providing acrobat pro to everybody so that they can have alterable pdfs.

    You'll "love" this part though.... The place I'm working has not one "approved" office package but 3. Yes, 3.

    • NeoOffice (mac's)
    • Libre Office (mac's and windows)
    • M$ Office (macs and windows, but we only have it because clients send us .doc's and want us to read/edit them.)
    While it's an internal document, nobody seems to care what format it's in. It makes templating a PITA because nothing quite talks to anything else 100%. That said, with the exception of 1-5 people, the regular engineers aren't doing anything that can't be done in any office package known to man.

    But it's not my call, it was a business decision made by the know-it-alls who get paid the big bucks. But that's more of an internal issue that I have to deal with rather than anything else.
     
  4. NSanity

    NSanity Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2002
    Messages:
    18,104
    Location:
    Canberra
    Given that PDF was only made an Open Standard in 2008 (same year as MS for ISO) I don't see how this is the case.

    Its proprietary software, free editions are missing "features", it costs a boatload to write real pdf's that are optimised - as opposed to shitty "pdfprinter" ones.

    Adobe's PDF standard is lightyears (6 years) ahead of any ISO/Documented Standard (See Adobe Extension Level 8 - n.b Level 5 is the latest publicly available).

    PDF is just as big a nuisance as any Office Format tbh.
     
  5. malbert

    malbert Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2009
    Messages:
    206
    Location:
    Canberra
  6. bcann

    bcann Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2006
    Messages:
    5,963
    Location:
    NSW
    its a Microsoft "standard". I'd bet my bottom dollar its open to Microsoft's interpretation and them changing it at the drop of a hat and not informing anyone.

    That is the MS way after all :)
     
  7. NSanity

    NSanity Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2002
    Messages:
    18,104
    Location:
    Canberra
    Except the fact that the big driver for MS was that;

    1. EU and other countries wanted an Open Document Standard
    2. MS felt that ODF either wasn't good/expansive enough to work with Office (at the time) or that migrating all their shit to ODF was going to cost too much and/or stifle their future development of their Office Suite.

    My understanding is that the EU is comfortable w/ MS so long as it meets the ISO standard. If they go changing their shit and making it not standard compliant - they risk losing that huge ass market.

    Office is big dick for them. They cannot afford to lose that market due to something as stupid as pissing everyone off with the standard change.
     
  8. PabloEscobar

    PabloEscobar Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2008
    Messages:
    14,227
    Yep, a docx file is just a zip file, unzip one, and view it in all its XML glory.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_software_that_supports_Office_Open_XML


    So, we've just had a discussion about companies being change resistant, but now when Microsoft want to change something, its a bad thing.

    Modern Microsoft is far less secretive than old fashioned Microsoft, and as they are to 3000 pound gorilla, when they want to modify the format, they can pretty much dictate the terms, but with their focus shifting more and more towards mobile and service, it doesn't make financial sense for them to hide the format changes away.

    http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/openness/
     
  9. Iceman

    Iceman Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2001
    Messages:
    6,647
    Location:
    Brisbane (nth), Australia
    It's clearly done by someone who has NFI what they're doing. The jacket cut is a mess. They haven't maintained twist ratios and they've apparently tried to follow the outside band of colors per socket (so half of A and half of B in effect) until they got to the bottom and couldn't make it match any more and went 'fuck it, 50/50 shot'. Based on the amount of cuts on the individual wires, they've had a few shots at punching it down with a cheap tool with a blunt cutter.

    Of course, since ethernet cabling is so simple even a monkey can do it .. clearly this was done by a porcupine with no thumbs.
     
  10. cvidler

    cvidler Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2001
    Messages:
    13,946
    Location:
    Canberra
    lol. this porcupine (although I'm sure it was a monkey of the knuckle dragging variety) needs to be kept away from any further cabling.
     
  11. EvilGenius

    EvilGenius Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2005
    Messages:
    10,632
    Location:
    elsewhere
    I'm going out of my mind.

    We're running one of our main sites off generator at the moment, shutting down when not 100% necessary to conserve fuel. The nortel phone system there isn't liking it so we've shut it down and diverted to a mobile. Turns out our number is only one number away from a major freight company in town, and they've diverted to us as well. So after setting this mobile up, I've started to receive a constant stream of calls for them, intermixed with the occasional call that is actually for us.

    Telstra have told us they've fixed it twice now. I'm still getting calls. :thumbdn:
     
  12. Gunna

    Gunna Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2001
    Messages:
    7,709
    Location:
    Brisbane
    You would think someone at the freight company would notice how quiet the phones have been and actually check the forward is working.....
     
  13. tin

    tin Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2001
    Messages:
    6,416
    Location:
    Narrabri NSW
    Office 2007 doesn't even follow the MS ISO standard they created themselves... Open Office was one of the first to properly support it, which says a lot.
     
  14. EvilGenius

    EvilGenius Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2005
    Messages:
    10,632
    Location:
    elsewhere
    You would wouldn't you. You'd also think telstra could manage to remove a divert from a number without any great undue hassle. Apparently not.
     
  15. PabloEscobar

    PabloEscobar Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2008
    Messages:
    14,227
    So many confusing words and product names :).

    Open Office XML (.docx) was fine in 2007
    OpenDocument (.odt) was a Microsoft supported Open Source standard, that 2007 failed on (until SP2).

    The Words "MS ISO Standard" don't really make sense when put together.

    My understanding is that it's either a Vendor specific format, OR an ISO Standard format (http://www.iso.org/iso/home/standards_development/who-develops-iso-standards.htm)
     
  16. NSanity

    NSanity Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2002
    Messages:
    18,104
    Location:
    Canberra
    Microsoft acknowledged this. And technically Office 2007 supports the standard that they put forward initially (although was rejected by ISO) - ECMA-376.

    Additionally whilst Office 2010 will only save in Transitional Format, Office 2013 will save in strict. MS provided a plugin for Office 2010 to open strict files however.

    Open Office didn't properly support shit - because it wasn't writing ISO 29500:2008 files - merely importing them.

    On this matter, LibreOffice claims to not fully support ISO 29500:2008 Strict yet either (despite Office 2013 doing it). Then again, Office 2013 only supports ODF 1.2, not 1.2 Extended - although they expect that Office will support ODF 1.2 extended/1.3 in due time.

    http://en.libreofficeforum.org/node/7505

    LibreOffice is also saying that they may never fully support 29500 - because its "unwieldy" beyond the means of a FOSS project. and they feel that ODF is "better".

    Technically not. http://ask.libreoffice.org/en/quest...docx-file-formats/?answer=36164#post-id-36164

    ECMA-376 (read / write by MS Office 2007; read only by MS Office 2010/2013)
    ISO/IEC 29500 Transitional (read / write by MS Office 2010/2013)*
    ISO/IEC 29500 Strict (read only by MS Office 2010; read / write by MS Office 2013)

    * MS Office 2007 was supposed to be able to read this format (which was supposed to be the same as ECMA-376), but Microsoft broke this. This issue is slated to be addressed in the next revision to ISO/IEC 29500.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2015
  17. Unframed

    Unframed Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    9,158
    Location:
    Hella south west
    Bullshit expectations.
    Laptop dropped on my desk at 4PM. I've got an hour and a half to turn a factory imaged Lenovo X1 into a Domain ready workstation with no Lenovo crapware and our standard office suite and AV installed.

    We don't have a standard image for systems either and this instance I wouldn't be allowed to do it anyway.

    I'm sure I'll get reemed for not finishing but I'd rather not miss my train when I've got 2.5hrs travel ahead of me.
     
  18. NSanity

    NSanity Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2002
    Messages:
    18,104
    Location:
    Canberra
    If you let it passively update, thats easily doable.

    If you update it, you're fucked.
     
  19. IACSecurity

    IACSecurity Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    760
    Location:
    ork.sg
    Fry it. Tell them it was broken when you got it. Must have been static.

    Then you have a few weeks while its fixed/replaced under warranty. :)
     
  20. Unframed

    Unframed Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    9,158
    Location:
    Hella south west
    Problem. The VP who dropped it on my desk did a fresh install and dropped it on my desk, running.
     

Share This Page

Advertisement: