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Consolidated Soldering and Rework thread

Discussion in 'Electronics & Electrics' started by trackhappy, Feb 23, 2013.

  1. OP
    OP
    trackhappy

    trackhappy Member

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    The PSU is a standard 0-30VDC 5A unit, probably the same electronics used in these standalone units and they get the job done. But I agree, I wouldn't be running anything sensitive off them, but it is nice to have the functionality there in the odd case that I might need to power up/blow up something in a pinch.


    I understand that generic Chinese gear may not be the best quality, but for occasional use (once or twice a week max) it should be fine? I don't expect it to last more than a couple of years, by then I'd have likely moved on to something of higher quality if my electronics hobby steps up. If it still works, great, I have a spare in case one of my future devices fails.


    He has a LOT of videos on power supplies, some of which I've watched at some point or another, but which of his videos would be pertinent to this case?

    Like I said, I wouldn't be expecting everything to be top quality from this thing, but the whole three-in-one thing really has me wanting to go for it. I need a soldering iron, it has one. I've been wanting a heatgun/reflow wand for a while, it has one. I've entertained the idea of a basic DC power supply, it has one. It can't be that bad, can it? I was about to buy a $17 HobbyKing station. :lol:
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2013
  2. RobRoySyd

    RobRoySyd Member

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    The presumption that Chinese made gear is substandard is wrong.
    Certainly there's plenty of products coming out of China that are but there's also an increasing range of products coming out of China that are superior to those made in the USA.
    Of course precious little is actually made in the USA or Europe these days anyway. The Chinese have learnt quickly and are now well past making cheap knock offs, they are improving upon the designs, using world class quality control and assurance and in many cases delivering a superior product at a lower price.
    I've been involved with one issue with Chinese designed and manufactured HMI ballasts. The problem was fairly quickly resolved by the manufacturer putting an engineer on a plane to Sydney.
    I had a shipment of new product damaged by water at Sydney Airport. Supplier sent me replacement packaging at no cost very promptly despite having no obligation to do so.

    The unit you're looking is probably just fine. The only thing I'd have a good look at is the mains earth bonding. I've come upon a number of lights where the paint hadn't been removed from around the hole for the earth lug. Also check for nuts and screws that have worked loose in transit or were never tightened properly.
     
  3. toopy28

    toopy28 Member

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    If you were going down that path I think I'd prefer the unit I linked to earlier in the thread, for an extra $20

    http://au.element14.com/tenma/21-10130-uk-eu/rework-station-900w-220v-uk-eu/dp/2062633
     
  4. nobbo

    nobbo New Member

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    I agree with rob, they have learnt quick , there is good stuff and bad , you just have to find it,
    I go there regularly and am learning real quick, but you still need precaution , stick to a brand name even if Chinese, example Gree is a aircondtioner and home appliance maker, no one knows them here but there thet sell 10,000 units a day !
     
  5. TERRA Operative

    TERRA Operative Member

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    It's not so much a matter of how often you'll use it, it's more an issue of whether it'll pop your arduino or the like when it starts producing transient voltages when you are tweaking the dials.

    The EEVBlog came across this issue on one of the supplies he looked at that sparked a recall by the Australian supplier who then went back to the manufacturer for a redesign (the Korad KA3005P). The resulting product was pretty good for a casual hobbyist.

    If you are just powering basic linear circuits, then the ebay one could be ok, but I wouldn't waste my $$$ on a potentially badly designed unit. I'd spend a little more on a proven unit.
    I don't mean to go and start mortgaging your house for high specced Agilent gear, but see what others (like EEVBlog I keep harping on about and Mikes electric blog) and buy a decent cheap unit, and buy it once...

    I deal with Chinese made electronics in the form of inverter welders, and there are numerous horror stories I come across all the time. They have been getting better over the years, but a lot of Chinese designed electronics is pretty budget oriented, usually in the wrong places.


    My brother has a few of these which are pretty good. They have 3 different current/volt ranges.

     
  6. mtma

    mtma Member

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    :thumbup:

    My opinion: You put a lot of trust in the tools you use. If it isn't able to complete its task reliably then you can forget how much you saved over the genuine thing, it wasn't worth a single cent that you paid for it.

    You probably have enough questions to answer from the circuit you're trying to make/diagnose/design, the last thing you need on top are tools that you need to second guess.
     
  7. OP
    OP
    trackhappy

    trackhappy Member

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    OK guys, I have almost settled on this Atten AT8586. EEV Blog did a review on the hot air gun (different machine but it has the exact same gun) and his verdict was that for the price you couldn't go wrong. The price he quoted was $80 or thereabouts.

    This is $90 and it comes with a soldering iron.

    My only concern with this iron is the wattage - is 50W enough for most work general work? From the reviews I've seen on YouTube, this station has a pretty decent recovery time and very fast warm-up time.

    This soldering station also accepts Hakko tips, and (some) spare parts are made for it. I'm very keen on going for it, I honestly don't see how I could do much wrong, especially since it has 12 months warranty.

    Thanks for all the help (and patience regarding my indecision) guys. :thumbup:
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2013
  8. BlueRaven

    BlueRaven Member

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    50W will be fine for most general-duty work, provided it has reasonable temp regulation and recovery time.
    The difference between a "50W" pencil iron and a proper temp-controlled station is massive.

    Plus, you get 3 nizzles fo shizzle (according to the pic). :lol:

    Go for it mate, can't really go wrong for that price, like the man said.
    Hell, if it breaks within the year, just get a new one. Aus seller so shipping will be cheap.
    If it lasts a few years of regular use, you probably got your money's worth.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2013
  9. OP
    OP
    trackhappy

    trackhappy Member

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    Video reviews show temp regulation is acceptable. Within 20C for heat gun, and adjusting the fan, the temperature takes 5-10 seconds to adjust as well.

    And support for all of Hakko's weird and wonderful soldering tips which conveniently is not mentioned. But three nizzles, yo.

    There isn't really much in these things to go wrong, except maybe the fan in the heatgun, which is replaceable, they do make spare parts.

    Cheers. :thumbup:
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2013
  10. TERRA Operative

    TERRA Operative Member

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    This is a deal maker. If you can get spare parts cheap, you're laughing.

    At that price, I might get one myself maybe and have a look inside. :D
     
  11. paulvk

    paulvk Member

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    If you can wait a little I should have one of those Atten AT8586 by next week so I can tell you what it is like, also from an AU seller infact it may already have arrived just away at the moment I get back monday.
     
  12. TERRA Operative

    TERRA Operative Member

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    FWIW, I finally uploaded the Yihua/Hakko comparison I did a while back.

     
  13. RussellK

    RussellK Member

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    Excellent vid - very informative, and best of all, very well shot - having someone on the camera to frame the shot as required makes a *huge* difference, putting it head and shoulders above many of the teardown vids where the shot routinely drops out of focus or the subject moves out of frame, or there's an awkward moment while the guy fiddles with the camera over his shoulder.

    Note: I used to work as a producer & post production supervisor - these simple little things in Youtube vids annoy the hell out of me.
     
  14. TERRA Operative

    TERRA Operative Member

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    Ha thanks, me and my bro are getting into filming docos. :) I mainly do the camera work on my HDR-FX1 cameras, but he does ok. He's just got to learn to use the focus ring on his camera for the close up shots to stop the focus from hunting. (I think there was one or two spots that were a little fuzzy). :)


    /Hijack.
     
  15. RussellK

    RussellK Member

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    Hobby King got these $17 Hakko knock-offs back in stock, so I jumped in and ordered one - as mentioned, for the price it's hard to go past. and I'll probably leave it at another site where the only soldering iron is a Portasol gas unit -which, in itself, is remarkably capable, but not the best if doing a lot of fine work.
     
  16. TERRA Operative

    TERRA Operative Member

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    I just grabbed another one too. :D
     
  17. paulvk

    paulvk Member

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    Ok I now have a Atten 8586 and have had it to bits (its now back together) full metal case with ground to case, uses a pic micro to control things, its construction is ok, one thing to note is that its 220V +-10% which is cutting things a bit close when I have measured voltages of up to 255V on the mains in 3 places in NSW this will mainly affect the transformer which may get hotter due to this but it does have a thermal cut out so no smoke can get out it will just stop working. As I have a hakko iron I compared the two, the tips are the same, metal sleeve on both are interchangeable, the resistances of the elements are not the atten is about half, the iron holder is a copy of the hakko (does not fit my hakko as its an older larger 900 ) . You get 3 round tips for the hot air. For the price I think its a good buy. When I have had a chance to use it I will let you know more. Note the supplied sponge is of no use.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2013
  18. OP
    OP
    trackhappy

    trackhappy Member

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    Cool. I've never seen voltage go above (or anywhere near) 250 here, according to my UPS, there isn't much solar to up the grid voltage when you're in a neighbourhood populated largely by bogans. :Paranoid:

    When you talked about resistances of the elements between the two irons, are you saying this affects recovery time (where the Atten takes twice as long)?

    I use golden pubes to clean my irons so no real issue there with the sponge. If I need to give the tip a good clean I wet a handful of tissues and use that, works in lieu of a sponge (as I haven't got one) but surely any sponge would work better than tissues.

    What I'd like to know when you get a chance to use it is:

    • Does the station show the actual temperature of the tip or just the temperature it has been set to?
    • Do the Solder/Rework LEDs light up when the element is heating (like what Hakkos do), or is it just static on?
    • What's the recovery time like? Could you do a larger joint with 50W?
    • Does it come with more than 1 soldering tip? If not what tip does it ship with?

    Thanks.
     
  19. aXis

    aXis Member

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    Wow, so glad I saw the link to the hobby King knock-off, I'd been thinking of a Hakko for a while but for the price of the hobbyking it's worth a try :)
     
  20. paulvk

    paulvk Member

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    It only comes with one soldering tip. The resistance values were ony for me to compare the hakko 900 if they were identical then I should be able to use the hakko in the station. At present I have 4 irons on my desk two wellers and a royel desoldering station which the hakko is plugged into. I think the hakko would work in the station but adjustments may need to be made to the temp setting which would mean doing this every time I swap irons there are two adjustments on the front for temp so you can calibrate the station. Now as to why I have 4 irons on my desk, one weller has a chisel point the other a conical point, the hakko a fine conical point and the royal is a vacuum de-soldering unit. As far as heat up time the wellers beat them all hands down 40seconds and the solder melts less than 60 seconds full temp is reached then there is a click as the switch releases the hakko takes much longer. The type of tip affects the soldering the chisel point heats the job fast and has more mass so contains more heat so I use it to remove components with and for general work, the others are for finer work. Note the two wellers run on 54volts DC and are 50watts as is the hakko. There are diffrent tips for irons as I have partly explained so if you will have only one iron you will be changing tips but if you have more than one than you just pick up the other iron as I do. With the price of the atten iron for the station on e-bay for around $12 I will likely but two more (a spare and another fit larger chisel tip) Now with the sponge a thick one from Coles/IGA/Wollies works fine I just use a 16mm hole punch to make a hole in it and cut it accross with a carton knife I get four per sponge the weller tips seem to clean best with a wet sponge. Now the only way to get better at soldering is practice the more you do the better you will get as with most things.

    Link for spare 907s http://www.aliexpress.com/store/pro...36B-AT938-AT938D-AT8586/104290_533930337.html
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2013

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