Film companies sue iiNet 'for allowing piracy'

Discussion in 'Networking, Telephony & Internet' started by Asgaldh, Nov 20, 2008.

  1. MR CHILLED

    MR CHILLED D'oh!

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    They have tried, and are trying many many MANY avenues and so far nothing is resulting in their favour. The energy expended fighting, is it really worth this effort?
     
  2. CAPT-Irrelevant

    CAPT-Irrelevant Member

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    It's a clear indicator that they're doinitrong.
     
  3. Vladdo

    Vladdo Member

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    Do you really think that some overly fat cat at the pinnacle of the corporate ladder is just going to roll over and accept what a judge tells them? Hardly. I cannot even begin to comprehend the resources that 7? film studios have at their disposal and they'll fight without ethics, morality or legality.

    The only way that I can really see to end all this is for everyone to keep doing exactly what they are doing.
     
  4. Dazatwrk

    Dazatwrk Member

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    No. The whole point of this case was always to lose. They knew going in they had no legal leg to stand on.

    BUT....

    When it's over, they'll use the fact that they lost to pressure the government to change the laws, that was the end game from the very beginning but all everyone in the press saw was "bully entertainment industry going after small iinet". Idiots. The real point of the case is to illustrate how we need new IP laws. And if you look at our government's history of bowing to content providers (the book industry for example), then we should be scared of what is coming.
     
  5. Aetherone

    Aetherone Member

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    Except for the lawyers. Instead of Merc's, Benz's and Rollers, they'll be looking at 300ft ex-russian mobster yachts before this is over.
     
  6. Vladdo

    Vladdo Member

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    And look what that has done for book retailers..

    I think the biggest thing that would be a huge step in the right direction is to for distributors to look at their pricing structure.. If they continue to treat the Au market like some third world backwater with rubbish releases at high prices then piracy rates will continue to skyrocket.. I've given up on buying copies from my local stores, as european releases are cheaper, more content and now free post..

    Even if the problem is about price, give people a reason not to copy.. I'm sure a lot of people would do the right thing if it was affordable.. Those people that choose to download copyrighted material would probably never pay for it anyway..

    It could be argued that steam has turned around a once void landscape of pc game sales.. Who could seriously be bothered pirating games that require patches and cracks when you can avoid it altogether for a few dollars. Again, those that do play pirated games weren't going to pay anyway..
     
  7. stevo4

    stevo4 Member

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    Cashed up old dudes desperately clinging to their failing distribution model/businesses.
    Not smart enough to do much more than parrot what they learnt years ago.
    Too lazy to look at new avenues to distribute their warez.

    Have too much money to burn, so they will keep trying to win a stay in the courts for their old ways.
     
  8. caspian

    caspian Member

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    AFACT - come at me, bro.

    I think it's an act of absolute desperation. the fact that they've pursued a lost cause so far is in of itself an admission that they have no way of controlling filesharing without resorting to having users disconnected altogether.
     
  9. influx

    influx Member

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    The HC might decide a grant of special leave is warranted, I would hope they dont though to save iinet more legal costs, and it puts the onus back on the Gillard govt to get off its ass and amend the Copyright Act to completely clarify one way or another the extent to which ISPs are liable, rather than have this shit constantly going through the courts at great cost to everyone involved
     
  10. -=ButFli=-

    -=ButFli=- Member

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    What do you mean "even more legal costs"? The general rule is that costs follow the event. As we can see here with the costs orders and all, big-film-company keeps losing then big-film-company keeps paying iiNet's costs.

    You've linked to the first instance judgment which was handed down on 4 February 2010 - just over a year ago. Today the judgment for the appeal was handed down. Effectively, three Judges said today that what one Judge said a year ago was right (or at least not too wrong).
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2011
  11. influx

    influx Member

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    costs orders dont even come close to covering all the direct and indirect costs of litigation.
     
  12. jET_M@X

    jET_M@X Member

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    Indirect opportunity costs such as iinet's CEO having to turn up in court to hear the decision i.e. iinet's staff that were called up as witnesses would have to spend time in court instead of doing their jobs at iinet. Lost productivity.
     
  13. iSTELTHYi

    iSTELTHYi Member

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    I dont like discs. That is why i refuse to buy DVD's/BR's.
    I'd be quite happy to pay to download movies and shows (and i dont mean paying $40 for a crappy movie), while this isn't an option, i'll use the only means i have.


    In case any people from Fox and the like are reading this, I'd rather go without than pay exuberant amounts to watch your low budget/lack of acting b grade movies. So either change your system, or miss out on profit.


    Side note for those thinking piracy is 'stealing'
    [​IMG]
     
  14. caspian

    caspian Member

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    absolutely. iiNet should be able to sue to recover these costs too, that might cut down on the time wasting litigation.

    @iSTELTHYi - if you think that's the extent of the argument you're taking a very simplistic view. to paraphrase Bill Gates, copyright theft isn't about stealing - it's about someone not getting paid for their work.

    I don't deny for a second that that's not a real problem (he says, poking a few more torrents into the box). the argument is about how the copyright owners go about addressing it, and gaining the right to hold service providers responsible for the actions of their customers is NOT it.
     
  15. millsy_c

    millsy_c Member

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    And that's it in a nutshell, IMO any posts discussing piracy unless directly relevant to this case should be reported for deletion, it's not on topic at all and will only stir up unneeded controversy.
     
  16. eixt

    eixt Member

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    They will go all the way to the High Court and lose. They knew they would most likely lose from the outset. That is not their end game, they have to pursue all legal avenues before they can go to the federal gov. to get laws changed.
    Conroy etc are likely to bow to lobbying pressure once that takes place. He has already hinted the government needs to introduce measures such as the three strikes policy.
     
  17. iSTELTHYi

    iSTELTHYi Member

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    That was more for the people who said it was stealing (theres 7 pages of replies, i only read up til page 5) even though they were posts from when it was first a hot topic.

    'Getting paid for their work'. That is the point I'm raising. The amount they want is not sufficent to the quality of their product. Like i said, i'll be happy to pay a dollar or whatever it may be to watch something, but theres no way in hell i'm paying 100 for it.

    Theres not any other option avaliable than to download most TV shows, some because they take years to air here, or they arent released on dvd. They need to get with the times, of be left behind (and sadly, if iiNet were to be found in breach, Australia would be the ones getting left behind. We'e far enough behind as it is....)
     
  18. fredhoon

    fredhoon Member

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    2010 / 2011, it appears I am still yet to make the transition. At the time I thought it was a bit strange that no one had linked that document above me.
     
  19. caspian

    caspian Member

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    I'm happy for them to lose comprehensively if that's what it takes. iiNet might not appreciate being put to the inconvenience and cost, but sometimes life isn't fair.

    then we're all going to be buying a private VPN tunnel that comes out somewhere with slightly less rigid interpretations of the law, and where copyright is something that happens to someone else.

    a dollar is unrealistic. that barely covers the costs of delivery, let alone the costs of production plus a fair profit for all involved.

    there's a little theory in economics called "normal profit". that's the ROI you could get if you stuck your investment cash in the bank and sat on a beach somewhere. in the real world, you add a little more to cover the costs of managing your investment. now you have to consider risk. dropping $200m on the latest hollywood epic is a major risk with no guarantee of a return. as a result, up again goes the reasonable expectation of a profit.

    I'd be prepared to pay $10-12 for a decent, non-DRM copy of a movie, that came out quickly worldwide, with no bullshit region coding, rootkits, spyware, or unskippable "don't copy me" warnings or useless Dolby promos.

    there I agree, and if the industry was being run by people who were looking forward to opportunities rather than in terror while clinging to the past, we might not be where we are now. in the meantime, the actions of the people are sending a clear message to the industry, I just don't think they want to hear it.
     
  20. K.I.L.E.R

    K.I.L.E.R Member

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    http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/02...Court-Gives-Green-Light-To-Disconnect-Pirates


    No good news comes from anything anymore. Now we can be disconnected for any reason.
     

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