[MAC Newbe question]Does the OSX need defraging??

Discussion in 'Apple Desktop Hardware/Software' started by GOD, Dec 4, 2005.

  1. GOD

    GOD (Banned or Deleted)

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    like what the question ask's??
    does it need defragging??
    is so then which is the best util to use it??
    just got a 17" PB and it seems little bit sluggish after installing all the apps...
    it's only a 1GHz version but still it has 1.5GB of ram and a new 16MB cache toshiba 80GB HDD.....

    does the OSX need defragging??

    Cheers...

    GOD.... ;)
     
  2. bugayev

    bugayev Whammy!

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    No it doesn't.

    What are "all the app's" you are talking about?
     
  3. titan

    titan Member

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  4. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    GAH!

    This is why I hate Microsoft. They infect the world with their stupidity.

    File system fragmentation was very common in the FAT (File Allocation Table) days. Early Microsoft operating systems like DOS, Windows 3.1X and Windows95/98/Me all used FAT file systems (FAT12 for floppy, FAT16 early on and then FAT32 post 2GB hard disks).

    FAT is bloody horrible. It fragments badly, and often. Fortunately for the rest of the world, every other operating system manufacturer had the brains to avoid it like the plague. Microsoft were the only ones *STUPID* enough to bother with it.

    Long story short, non-Microsoft OSes don't need to be "defragged". Their file systems are resistant to fragmentation, and often auto defragment over time (which is the case with OSX). In fact, even WindowsXP's NTFS is fragmentation resistant. Microsoft themselves finally realised how crap FAT is and dropped it like a hot potatoe.

    It amazes me how quickly people upgrade video cards and CPUs in this day and age, yet how desperately they hold onto legacy information like this.
     
  5. SteakTheMooCow

    SteakTheMooCow (Taking a Break)

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    NTFS still needs defragmentation if you install 50+ apps in one hit on a 60GB+ drive... it doesn't actually make THAT MUCH a difference if you don't do it... I defrag my Windows drive maybe 4 times a day, but that's because if I'm in Windows I'm usually cleaning files up and moving 10+ gigabytes at a time, which tends to fragment like a gang when the cops appear.

    Linux I've -never- even seen a defragmentation application (eg: The Portage Tree shows none). Mac OSX "Optimises" your disk after every package install (so anything with an OSX style installer). Neither require a defrag...

    *bashes head on desk*

    The reason you're probably experiencing "sluggishness" is because you've just effectively shrunk the maximum size of the "Virtual RAM." Similar to a page file (although it seems faster) it can only use free disk space...
     
  6. rtscts

    rtscts Member

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    All writable filesystems fragment, anyone who says otherwise is an idiot. That doesn't necessarily mean it's an issue though. Complex disk structures, intelligent drivers and on-the-fly opimisations can reduce cases where fragmentation is necessary and reduce the effects of fragmentation when it does occur. Particularly with regards to FAT, which was not designed to deal with fragmentation well, and didn't have drivers worth a damn.

    Any modern filesystem would have to be seriously fragmented to cause noticable performance loss though, and that would tend to only come about with unusual usage.
     
  7. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    To clarify, I didn't say that non-FAT filesystems do not fragment. That would be absurd. Many of them self-defragment (MacOSX and HFS+ partitions do this nicely, assuming you have a reasonable amount of free space on the drive at all times).

    But as mentioned, fragmentation on modern file systems doesn't affect performance nearly as much as the good old days of FAT. And more importantly, they do not *need* to be defragged as you would with FAT.

    Apologies if I didn't make that clear.

    That isn't actually a defrag, but is rather the system prelinking certain libraries with binaries so that applications can start faster. You can do the same manually in Linux/UNIX/BSD if you don't upgrade too frequently.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2005
  8. SteakTheMooCow

    SteakTheMooCow (Taking a Break)

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    Yeah, was careful not to call it a defrag ;)
     
  9. jboles

    jboles Member

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    There are Mac software programs out there which do defrag the disk. They are largely useless though, as a commanded defrag is unecessary. In many cases they actually make things worse as they disrupt the 'hot band', an area of specially-placed files that speed up startup.

    http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=25668


    Edit: I believe prebinding (what OSX calls "optimizing the system") is unnecessary as of OS 10.4.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2005
  10. Eroda

    Eroda Member

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    it depends on what software what installed, you might have installed softare in weird places and or that super fast 16mb cache hdd is infact a stocky model with 2mb cache you shoul open and check.
     
  11. NV28_OF_NV28GL

    NV28_OF_NV28GL Member

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    iDefrag is one program, but note that HFS+ actually does defragmenting itself, I think touching files over 20MB usually triggers it afaik, but its non noticeable.
     

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