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NVidia G84 and G86 Problems

Discussion in 'Video Cards & Monitors' started by oldbugger, Jul 10, 2008.

  1. oldbugger

    oldbugger Member

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    It appears that there are significant problems with all NVidia G84 and G86 graphics chips...they are all expected to go belly up over time. It appears primarily related to the increase in voltage between the A02 and A03 stepping from 1.3v to 1.375v to overcome other stability problems. Apparently NVidia did this knowing that it would increase the chip's thermal specs beyond original....and this has caused the substrate issue to arise. It is affecting all manufacturers who use the G84 and G86 chips...mobile and desktop GPUs.

    It also appears that NVidia is playing true to form and trying to cover the extent of it up (even to the extent of removing forum posts) and blame everyone else. They have set aside more than $200m for the problem but analysts expect it to cost them much more.

    There is going to be a lot of unhappy campers out there...

    see the link

    http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2008/07/09/nvidia-g84-g86-bad
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2008
  2. stablez

    stablez Member

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    Bugger. Ar well iam waiting for my music to be converted to my N73 via bluetooth.
    this is NV's problem and a solution is to prolong the fault.:upset:
    What a joke. 10 points to ATI.
     
  3. sandwichamwin

    sandwichamwin Member

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    The Inquirer...

    I don't think i need to say more :lol:
     
  4. OP
    OP
    oldbugger

    oldbugger Member

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    Nah there is too much in it...NVidia have put a $200m cost in their accounts for this as a starter...you don't do that unless it is more than a bit of smoke.... and there is a lot of scuttlebutt around about NVidia and their partners going to AMD and the supposed feud with their suppliers. The silence treatment usually means that there is more to it than they want to admit.

    Shooting the messenger will not help in this case I reckon...Inquirer or not (although the usually are not too far off the mark most of the time). We will have to wait and see what happens I suppose....I really hope the reports are wrong for the sake of those with the cards/mobos.
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2008
  5. OP
    OP
    oldbugger

    oldbugger Member

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    Last edited: Jul 29, 2008
  6. MR CHILLED

    MR CHILLED D'oh!

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    What's wrong with The Inquirer? It's more or less a gossip site for a lot of industry information (in that way I think it's good).....but you know this going in and you certainly don't take their stuff as being cold hard fact.
     
  7. OP
    OP
    oldbugger

    oldbugger Member

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    And another site:

    http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/...lly_Faulty_Nvidia_GeForce_Graphics_Cards.html

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/07/28/dell_nvidia_chipset_glitch/

    I think this has a way to run yet...and I hope those who have these systems are treated fairly and not shunted aside by spin and PR to avoid warranty obligations. A real measure of a company's care for its customers is how it honors its warranty obligations....whether it be to acknowledge and correct a products shortcomings or whether it is only to avoid the spotlight of bad publicity by doing the absolute minimum and hiding the true extent of the issues..
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2008
  8. OP
    OP
    oldbugger

    oldbugger Member

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  9. 8MadDog8

    8MadDog8 Member

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    So whats this mean for people with laptops with the G86/G84 chips?

    Are they covered under warranty? Or only if they fail?
     
  10. Vladdo

    Vladdo Member

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    Only if they fail under warranty.. because its something that will fail over a period of time, it will most likely cause a number of laptops to fail long after the warranty has expired.. if had a laptop with one of these gpus.. i'd be hitting it with ATI Tool.. rebooting.. let sit for 5 mins, then do another cycle...

    deliberately cause it to fail.. if it doesn't then, you might be in luck and should last for some time to come..
     
  11. OP
    OP
    oldbugger

    oldbugger Member

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  12. OP
    OP
    oldbugger

    oldbugger Member

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    All G8X chips and G92-G94 chips affected as well.

    Dell swamped with failed laptops and are replacing whole laptop rather than repair video subsystem. Nividia is also sending bad parts out as replacements as there are no good replacement parts. HP and Dell are extending warranties which will also exacerbate the problem for NVidia who it appears was trying to stretch the issue past warranty periods.

    Now it looks like all desktop G8X chips are affected as well as G92 and G94 chips. I really hope this is wrong.

    And please don't shoot the messenger. The Inquirer has been spot on so far with this.

    http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2008/08/12/nvidia-g92s-g94-reportedly
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2008
  13. Chemware

    Chemware Member

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    Re:

    Nvidia G92s and G94 reportedly failing

    Anybody wanna buy a slightly used 8800GT ?

    Realistically though, with the crummy standard cooling on the 8800GT, I wouldn't be surprised if they now start dying like flies.
     
  14. prezident doom

    prezident doom Member

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    Very worrying... makes me glad i switched back to ATI when i did.
     
  15. oohms

    oohms Member

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    This whole thing is very strange. I highly doubt its voltage on its own that killed these cards... I have run an 8400GS at about 1.5v for a few months in a work pc

    http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=174414

    Also nobody was able to kill these cards, apart from blowing up the power regulators (some people ran over 2v too) but they all had adequate cooling.

    From working at a high volume pc store i have yet to see an increase in returns on the cards too. (And lower end nvidia cards are very popular)

    Also the majority of low end (8400GS, 8500GT, 8600GT) cards use a non reference design, where the vendor will design the PCB, choose components and the cooling solution as well. I have almost never seen a reference card lower than the 8600GT.


    The only thing i can think of is that nvidia designed a reference board + cooling solution which is the one that they sell to dell, HP, etc, that might not have a good sink, and they overheat and cause artifacts etc...
     
  16. OP
    OP
    oldbugger

    oldbugger Member

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    Apparently it is the solder substrate. The one specified by NVidia is more fragile/brittle and more subject to failure with repeated heat-up - cool-down cycles....exacerbated by increased heat from higher voltages. NVidia has also recently changed their source of this material and altered the specs as well to a less susceptible material.
     
  17. scheps

    scheps Member

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    what symptoms should we expect? just artifacts or random game crashes without clear reason ?
     
  18. OP
    OP
    oldbugger

    oldbugger Member

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    I would suspect any or all of the above....depending which area of the card was affected there could be a number of symptoms....you would just have to isolate the card as the issue. Here are two ways...
    1. try another card to see if the symptoms persist...if so it is not the card...if they stop then it is likely to be the card; or alternatively
    2. you could try the suspect card in another system...if it continues to fail then it is likely the card....if the problems do not appear then it is not the card at fault.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2008
  19. shift6

    shift6 Member

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  20. OP
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    oldbugger

    oldbugger Member

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