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RIP OpenSolaris?

Discussion in 'Other Operating Systems' started by Hodge, Aug 9, 2010.

  1. armbarcrash

    armbarcrash Member

    Dec 10, 2005
    My employer is a big consumer of Sun hardware and Solaris. I recently went out to some Sun vendors looking for quotes on quite a bit of new hardware and got a rude shock.

    The prices have gone up 10%+ base and Oracle have abolished every support option other than 'Premium Super Expensive Oracle 4 hour' (my words) and no support. They also add about 5% 'delivery' to the price of the kit.

    The 'premium' support option added almost 20% to base price of all the gear. In my job, no support is actually an option as we can direct the saved cash to a spares pool or support option the servers later if Oracle come to their senses.

    I'll likely not be using Sun hardware in future, especially when I hear whispers of x64 being put to bed and SPARC being pushed again by Oracle.

    To me, it seems Oracle want to be a 'vertical integrator' in the Enterprise, much like Apple in the home. They want to sell you the hardware, the software, the accessories and nice expensive support that 95% you'll likely not need.

    On the personal front, it's a pain in the ass as my home NAS is running on OpenSolaris b134 with ZFS version 23. From what I understand (and correct me if wrong), even if Oracle pull the CDDL licence off ZFS tomorrow, it won't stop the port/fork work that mobs like FreeBSD and Illumos have going on.
  2. grs1961

    grs1961 Member

    Jan 21, 2005
    No, it's, "What level of support are you on?", "Oh, I see, it's the pass this call straight to someone who can do something level, please hold..." for some boxen, and "Um, I don't think we support that any more" (which is particularly amusing when the call is internal!!)

    Now, I know there are other levels (back in the 1990's an RS/60001 shipped from Switzerland whose boot disk died - "We can't find this in the database, it will cost $x,000 to add it, or we can do it for $y00/hour - oh, no we can't, it has to be in the database as being in Oz for us to do anything") and all sorts of variations between, but, as in anything, you choose the level of risk you are willing to take, and pay accordingly.

    And, of course, I can be the person at the other end of the support request - some customers get the "Have you installed the latest patches?", where others get the, "Right, let's wade in and fix this mongrel...". It's the way that companies make money, get used to it.

    FWIW - I run an S10 server at home (and develop on and administer Solaris and other systems at work), and am not happy about what is happening with Solaris and OpenSolaris, but it's the way things go. Face it, Sun's strategy was not making them money, and Oracle wants to make money.

    1 - Funnily enough, the box was built in Wodonga!!
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2010
  3. stmok

    stmok Member

    Jul 24, 2001
    Solaris still sorta open, but OpenSolaris distro is dead

    (Sucks to be that guy...Spent 4 years with code contributions. Only to get a "Ha! Ha!" from Oracle.)

    What's next? OpenOffice? VirtualBox?
  4. armbarcrash

    armbarcrash Member

    Dec 10, 2005
    Probably. Mind you, like all opensource code, it'll just fork if you try to close it down.
  5. Bangers

    Bangers Member

    Dec 25, 2001
    Silicon Valley
    I for one (in lieu of sparking emotional debate) am extremely happy ORCL are pulling out certain aspects of the Open Source world. It's obviously for selfish reasons but it's leading and prepping them to introduce some major (!) and desirable enterprise features they uncle Larry simply won't invest in without the element of exclusivity.

    I'm not talking about running Solaris on SUN hardware, or even running some of there bigger kit. It's hard to say (without NDA's) but effectually anyone who was in/was in the Tru64, Storage and Clustering days should be able to easily piece together what's happening. Essentially wait for ZFS to be pulled from the open world, global support will be added to it (to name one of many new features) and then this can then be ported into SUN Cluster (specifically scalable resources) and other applications. All the pieces are in the right place now, it was always going to be a matter of ORCL putting themselves in a position to capitalizing on it.

    It's disappointing news for small shops or home users looking to run on a serious storage platform (note I didn't say Solaris because most users really only want ZFS). It's even worse when you factor in ORCL are paying the salaries of all BTRFS developers1. The other side of the coin is that this is a space RHT need to (and will soon if they know what's good for them) drive independently themselves.

    Executive summary: Yes it's disappointing news for people who want the equivalent of ZFS. RHL should have stepped on years ago. End result is home users and small shops will no longer run Solaris but the enterprise world will benefit a great deal.

    1 Does anyone know who's funding and driving BTRFS outside of ORCL? I tried to look but couldn't find this info anywhere. Surely there's someone on LKML who are independently (and slowly) driving it. Linux obviously needs it.

    Just to make my point super obvious. ORCL aren't pulling out of the open world because they don't want people to have the product for free. They don't want people to have features going into the product for free. This doesn't make them as bad as some people like to make out.
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2010
  6. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

    Jun 27, 2001
    Lustre+ZFS in one package has been a long-term target for Sun for a long time. I have no doubt Oracle want to continue down that path (particularly with products like RAC, which could be complementary).

    Oracle really are preparing themselves for a "top to toe" clustered solution with support across the whole gamut. As much as I don't like it going back to proprietary/closed code, I am VERY interested to see how they go. A "enterprise cluster in a box" solution will really shake up the market right now, as people normally have to spend a great deal of time and money doing this for themselves (says me, waiting for my test Gluster setup to install on KVM as I type this).

    I had the impression Theodore Tso was working on it too, as BtrFS has been earmarked as the successor to Linux Extended File Systems (with the latest being Ext4FS, which was merely a temporary solution until BtrFS went stable).

    Tso is ex-IBM, but now works for Google. Google are upgrading en mass from Ext2 to Ext4, skipping 3 entirely as it adds too much latency for them, and it appears they went "straight to the source" for their support. I can't say with any certainty, but I wouldn't be surprised if Google are putting at least some resources towards BtrFS (if not just Tso himself in his own time, or the "20% community/FLOSS devel" time Google mandate for all employees).

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