Ryzen 5000 Series Discussion

Discussion in 'AMD x86 CPUs and chipsets' started by Skramit, Nov 7, 2019.

  1. Aussiejuggalo

    Aussiejuggalo Member

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    I don't care about brand as long as it has all the shit I want and fit's my mATX case ;).
     
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  2. chook

    chook Member

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    Yeah, my care for aesthetics kind of ends at the box outside but I love looking at the things other people build and really appreciate the effort and the creativity. While I may not care so much myself I am not going to knock another person for using their resources doing something they enjoy. Do I like Pink's music? Nope. Is Pink a fantastic entertainer? Yep.
     
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  3. chook

    chook Member

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  4. Digit

    Digit Member

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  5. mesaoz

    mesaoz Member

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    Might be to signify that they are using different GPU architecture between them if the new socs are using rdna
     
  6. RnR

    RnR Member

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    Nah... its all Vega. RDNA1 won't be used in an APU. Only RDNA2.

    I was against this mixing of Zen2 and Zen3, but I'm ok with it now based on the list above.

    I just don't understand why. Why make new Zen 2 dies when you have Zen 3?
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2020
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  7. Malakai

    Malakai Member

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    That is fantastic that AMD are only listing the 5950X as 4.9GHz but it tickles 5GHz... they might have learnt from the fallout of the Zen 2 clock speed debacle. With specs it is much better to aim low and hit high, it flips reviews on their head in a good way when they go higher than expected.
     
  8. Phido

    Phido Member

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    ECHO off for the l33t. It is hard to believe that the Ryzen 5000 is still pounding 40% uplift in x86 performance on generation ~40 years after the first XT landed.

    read something before, 10-20% uplift expected. Given AMD recent history, I wouldn't be surprised. They have real momentum. They are earning good coin. They have a good business model.
     
  9. chook

    chook Member

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    I am still not entirely keen on it but I (we?) am probably looking at it from a position most people aren't. For the people to whom the microarchitecture matters they probably know how to check which one it is while for the unwashed masses they don't care.
     
  10. RnR

    RnR Member

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    You are quoting a source that is making stuff up then. Would love a link though ;) At this point nothing has been leaked in regards to 'Warhol' other than this image;

    upload_2020-10-24_12-23-35.png

    Thats it. A 10-20% uplift is something my grandmother could predict, and I would argue that a 10% uplift is not a 'significant upgrade' as your original point was.
     
  11. Phido

    Phido Member

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    Well we should be more specific here. AMD has generally been consistent wit 10% improvement gen on gen on ALU. Through IPC and clockspeed improvements. May not be significant for some, however, very significant in comparison to Intel, particularly if they already have a lead over intel.

    Ryzen 5000 will be more like 15%. However FPU/Encoding improvements are more like 20%, With Ryzen 5000 showing more like 40% improvement in benchmarks. However, AMD has included significant performance increases before in rendering and encoding.
    upload_2020-10-24_13-43-32.png

    11.6% gain between 1800x and 2700x
    19% gain between 2700x and 3800x.
    With Ryzen 5000 we would probably see close to 50% gain in performance in Cinebench r15 multi.

    Linking ALU and FPU performance is problematic. It depends on your workload.

    With Ryzen 6000 I would full expect ~25%+ increase in FPU/Encoding performance. Given how significantly they reworked the FPU in Ryzen 5000, there is a huge opportunity to refine and optimize. There are also new instructions particularly in encoding and tweaks to instructions and parallelism around encoding. Some of this wasn't possible when Ryzen 5000 was designed, because programmers hadn't taken advantage of AVX2 etc coding in very efficient or at all ways at that stage. These days AVX instructions are used in everything, like video teleconferencing, encoding, audio, rendering, etc.

    For some 10% isn't significant if its ALU. 20%+ for FPU might be irrelevant. However, if you encode video, then a 20+% improvement is huge and would be getting close to a whole product line jump (ie 12 core to 16 core).

    For 6000 its likely to be a big jump in FPU/Encoding performance, much like the 2000 to 3000 jump was. 25% in data compression uplift, 25-30% uplift in general FPU and 30+ in Encoding. But if all your concerned is gaming performance, then 10% probably won't be as mind blowing.


    Ryzen 5000 won't be 40-50% improvement in gaming performance over Ryzen 3000. But it will in FPU and encoding performance.
     
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  12. RnR

    RnR Member

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    I was just after a link mate... thats all :)
     
  13. Phido

    Phido Member

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    Oh no worries.

    Sorry, super interested in this. Or for other people who may not understand what I am talking about..
     
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  14. 335 GT

    335 GT Member

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    I suspect it's because that's where some Zen 2's fit the performance tier.
    So they are numbering for performance instead of generations.

    If a 5700u is faster than a 5600u I'm ok with that. In the long run it doesn't matter what core is in it, provided it's faster.
     
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  15. nope

    nope Member

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    mmm i think the paste is stuffed and coolers probably come loose (lots of lans)
     
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  16. Malakai

    Malakai Member

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  17. Ratzz

    Ratzz Member

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    Looks like pretty decent value given we already know the 3090 is 3 grand on its own.

    EDIT: OK I see what you mean. I saw the 3800X, I didn't see the 5950X immediately following it.

    I don't find it confusing at all. I don't look at APU's anyway, so it just goes over my head. I'll only be looking at chips with a 5xxx(X) nomenclature. How they name the APU's is irrelevant to me.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2020
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  18. RnR

    RnR Member

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    Sure, this is par for the course, if AMD wants to spend the time/money for this. Maybe they don't for Warhol because AMD's usual cadence of cpu releases breaks down a little in 2021/2022;

    Code:
    Summit Ridge    Zen 1   Feb 2017
    Pinnacle Ridge  Zen+    Apr 2018    +14 months
    Matisse         Zen 2   Jul 2019    +15 months
    Vermeer         Zen 3   Nov 2020    +15 months
    Warhol          Zen 3+  Feb 2022    +15 months*
    Raphael         Zen 4   Jun 2023    +15 months*
    
    * - expected
    
    But we have indications that Warhol is coming out in 2021. And Raphael is coming out in 2022. Does this mean the cadence is speeding up? Or is Warhol a deliverable for 2021 so the marketing guys are happy, and then the usual cadence begins again?

    There is one clue. The Zen 1+ design never appeared as a server chip. And we know the next server codenames, Milan (Zen 3) and Genoa (Zen 4). So no server cpu's will have the Warhol (Zen 3+) design. This suggests to me that Zen 3+ will be a 'design-lite' release cpu wise, like Zen 1+ was (+3% IPC, +6% clock from dark silicon - so same design as Zen 1 with minor tweaks). They may use this release to transition to DDR5. Or not. Not much is known about AMD's intentions in regards to Warhol. A while back some Korean/Chinese twitter leaker pondered... "Why Warhol?".

    And this is why I was asking for a link to whatever you had read. Because whatever it was, it clearly made you very certain that the next cpu release will be a "significant upgrade on 5000 CPU". And like you I am also very interested in this, so if you have read something like this, I wanna read it too. And I am sure that others do too.
     
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  19. Digit

    Digit Member

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    I get what you're saying, and I'm also only concerned with CPUs, at least for my desktop system.

    But what about laptops? What I feel like could happen is a laptop chassis may have a couple options for apu, and you have to research which arch the apu is based on to ensure you're getting the right one, as I'm sure there will be hype, and (purely speculation) probably a performance overlap between the generations. It's not too hard, but it's certainly not as easy as saying gen 5 vs gen 6
     
  20. Phido

    Phido Member

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    Well that could be key, AMD original plan was to move to DDR5, but that seems to have been pushed back a little bit. Maybe Zen3+ won't be a huge upgrade, and AMD expects the platform to sell because of DDR5 and PCIE 5 and the performance boost that that gives. Given that, AMD may have focused their efforts on improved cache (to work with ddr5), and improving FPU performance.. People will buy AM5 even if the first gen CPU doesn't offer a huge upgrade.

    AMD is also adjusting its plans ever so slightly. The whole ryzen 5000 rename thing caught most people off guard.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2020

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