1. If you're receiving a message that you are banned from the Current Events or Politics forums, it's not you specifically: those forums have been hidden for all users. For more info, see here.
    Dismiss Notice

The enormous Virtualisation help thread

Discussion in 'Other Operating Systems' started by elvis, May 11, 2011.

  1. J-C90

    J-C90 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2010
    Messages:
    293
    Location:
    VM01
    Anyone have any experience with OpenNode?

    Up until now I've been using ESXi 3.5 on older Proliant hardware(non VT chips), my employer is about to spring to for a newer host machine with VT support so I'm thinking of going to KVM. The OpenNode project looks pretty slick but couldnt find it mentioned on here anywhere. Looking for any feedback.
     
  2. 3t3rna1

    3t3rna1 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2001
    Messages:
    1,452
    Location:
    Perth
    You might find Proxmox a better solution, it seems a fair bit more mature than OpenNode and you can get commercial support for it. There is also oVirt which you may like as it's backed by Redhat.

    http://www.proxmox.com/
     
  3. J-C90

    J-C90 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2010
    Messages:
    293
    Location:
    VM01
    Ok, we are now considering application virtualisation as a possible alternative to full desktop virtualisation. I have a guy coming in next week to take a look and discuss what he can offer. I didnt organise it so am not sure what his background is but it sounds like he's selling Microsoft, so probably something along the lines of app-v?

    We dont have a microsoft server box here(like to keep it that way if possible!) so I'd like to get some idea of whats available on Linux that can provide a comparable experience before he sells the directors on a windows based solution. I really cant see that a MS solution will be finaincially viable for a small company like us anyhow but I need to be informed as much as possible.

    The aim is to:

    - Extend desktop PC life(ie. removing resource intensive apps to the server)

    - Provide better access to LAN resources from outside the LAN.

    Some users have found that accessing a virtual PC on the LAN from home or on the road provides a better experience than running applications locally and accessing the network via a VPN(eg. MYOB) or natively across the WAN(ie. Lotus Notes database server.) They can also use their tablets or smart phones to work remotely via the virtual PC.

    I see things like InstallFree and Application JukeBox appear to be Red Hat friendly(we run mainly Centos). Would these or any other services available provide windows application virtualisation similar to what we would be looking for on a Linux host?
     
  4. hollstar

    hollstar Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2002
    Messages:
    446
    Location:
    Brisbane
    Hi Everyone,
    I'm hoping someone here can point me in the right direction. I have a box running four KVM based VM's that has a network issue of some description after an unknown period of time.

    Essentially the VM's still have network access but the host doesn't. I can't SSH into the host (but I could into the VM's), it seemingly can't talk to the outside world (ping, apt-get update etc), even trying to restart the network service fails. The only solution is to reboot the host. Once you do, everything works as you'd expect.

    My question is where do I begin to look for the issue? What log files should I be looking for and where etc etc?
     
  5. wellonchompy

    wellonchompy Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2002
    Messages:
    747
    Location:
    Sydney
    That doesn't sound like a virtualisation problem, to be honest.

    Have you done the usual troubleshooting? Checking iptables and netstat to see if ports are blocked or bound? /var/log/messages and dmesg to see if the kernel is reporting anything strange? tcpdump on the interface to see if the packets are reaching the kernel?

    KVM is a kernel module on top of a regular kernel, and the only thing it really does to the network stack is to add bridged devices. I can't see it causing external interfaces to stop accepting packets, unless you've got a buggy libvirt version that is doing something weird with dnsmasq, and even then it should be pretty obvious where the problem is.
     
  6. joe_sixpack

    joe_sixpack Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2002
    Messages:
    2,850
    Location:
    Brisbane
    First thing I would do, is jump straight into the console and setup some iptable counters to see if there's any activity...

    for example:

    iptables -N SSH_TEST
    iptables -A SSH_TEST -j RETURN
    iptables -I INPUT -p tcp --dport 22 -j SSH_TEST

    the above will setup a simple way to see if you have traffic hitting the machine, without disrupting your existing rules.

    Next simply keep an eye on "pkts" and "bytes" columns for the newly created rules...

    iptables -vnL

    You should see pkts/bytes increase, once you've gathered that information, then you could add in some logging and go from there.
     
  7. hollstar

    hollstar Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2002
    Messages:
    446
    Location:
    Brisbane
    Thanks for the help guys, really appreciated. :)

    The reason I'd suggested it was a KVM issue was because whilst the host machine seemingly lost some form of network connectivity, the guests were always fine. My logic told me that obviously "stuff" is making it through otherwise the guests would work. Unfortunately being a bit of a novice, I wasn't (and still aren't) really sure what I should be looking out for in the respective logs or tcpdump...

    I will have a bit of a snoop around and see what I can find! Thanks Again. :thumbup:
     
  8. foxmulder881

    foxmulder881 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2004
    Messages:
    5,884
    Location:
    Gold Coast, QLD OS:Linux
    Anyone doing anything interesting with their virtual systems lately?
     
  9. oli

    oli Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2002
    Messages:
    7,268
    Location:
    The Internet

    I'd only used OpenVZ till now. I just deployed a node with KVM. I can't get Windows working but everything else works really well... FreeBSD and all Linux variants with custom kernels, etc...

    Haven't decided if I care enough about a tiny number of customers wanting Windows to bother trying to get it working or not. :tongue:
     
  10. mundy

    mundy Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2007
    Messages:
    62
    Location:
    Mandurah, WA
    I just bought a bunch of hardware so I can finally build my home KVM server this weekend
     
  11. hollstar

    hollstar Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2002
    Messages:
    446
    Location:
    Brisbane
    Hello All,

    I'd appreciate a few peoples thoughts and opinions on this.

    I have a client who has just purchased a HP ML350p (Xeon 2.0 GHz 6 Core), 32GB RAM and a RAID 5 configuration of 5 x 1TB SFF 7.2K SAS drives. The box will replace an existing SBS 2003 system so we'll be going across to 2011.

    The box was designed to handle the usual array of AD, Exchange and File/Print for some 15-20 users, however it must also handle a new SQL (Express) database in the next 3-6 months to replace an Access system.

    Coming full circle, I'm considering my virtual options and want peoples feedback.

    Despite the database developer approving the specifications, I'm taking a 50/50 bet that he can get away with SQL Express. I'm also taking into account that the client wants to run their own Anti-SPAM Gateway which we'd do through Postfix/ClamAV/SPAM Assassin.

    The sum total of my VM experience has been a Ubuntu host with KVM both in testing and production environments. I've been happy with it its performance, but its been for more low level stuff.

    How would other people handle the same situation? :)

    Many thanks in advance! :thumbup:
     
  12. Gecko

    Gecko Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2004
    Messages:
    2,715
    Location:
    Sydney
    My big concern with that spec is going to be I/O performance - RAID5 and 7.2k drives aren't going to behave well with heavy I/O. The CPU may also be a bottleneck depending on your workloads, but you're certainly not going to run into RAM limitations.

    We use KVM with some custom wrappers around libvirt here (just some fancy shell scripts that also handle dealing with Gluster), which we love. In our workloads, KVM was the superior option (at least 18 months ago when we did our most recent round of testing, the landscape may have changed by now).

    A few options to investigate if you are looking for something a bit more user-friendly are Citrix XenServer (free version may suit your needs), Proxmox PVE which is a nice wrapper around KVM and OpenVZ that I've used before with success and HyperV is surprisingly good if your VMs are Windows based.

    Avoid VMWare like the plague.
     
  13. OP
    OP
    elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2001
    Messages:
    44,852
    Location:
    Brisbane
    I'm testing the latest release of oVirt again this week for our web dev team.

    http://www.ovirt.org

    I tested it a year back, and it wasn't quite up to scratch. The latest release looks pretty good on paper, so let's see how it goes.
     
  14. hollstar

    hollstar Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2002
    Messages:
    446
    Location:
    Brisbane
    I can understand that but I don't think it will be a big issue in this instance. The overall workload will be minimal with the bulk of the work being with sub 10MB files, my only concern was around the database.

    Anyway. Thanks Gecko, gives me some food for thought.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2013
  15. 3t3rna1

    3t3rna1 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2001
    Messages:
    1,452
    Location:
    Perth
    I've been pleasantly surprised at how little storage you can get away with when using QEMU. The Linux page cache does a brilliant job at caching reads and the QEMU writeback cache does quite well at coalescing writes.

    With 24x 7.2k rpm disks (in Raid 10 running XFS) I was running about 40 MSSQL servers of lightish load and Exchange for 800 Mailboxes. It wasn't lightning fast but it kept running well day after day. The only real load on the disks was random write, reads were negligable.

    Alternatively you can move away from the traditional linux file systems and run one with copy-on-write to preserve your write speeds. I've had good experiences with the ZFS-on-linux modules plus you can install an SSD or two later on to improve disk speeds if need be. BTRFS is still a little dodgy at times, I wouldn't reccommend it in production just yet (as of the 3.7.x kernel)
     
  16. Gecko

    Gecko Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2004
    Messages:
    2,715
    Location:
    Sydney
    24 vs 5 spindles will make all the difference there.

    Elvis, I'm keen to hear how oVirt runs for you, also interested to see the writeup of the giant Gluster system.
     
  17. Swathe

    Swathe (Banned or Deleted)

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2007
    Messages:
    2,508
    Location:
    Rockhampton
    I'm very interested in this. Not because I'll be implementing one myself but I've always found Elvis to be a wealth of information on here and I'm sure I'll learn a crapload from it :D
     
  18. cbb1935

    cbb1935 Guest

    I think this is the right place to ask..

    I need a machine that will allow me to run 2 x Server 2008 (with Exchange 07) VM's, and a single instance Win7 Pro VM. Sometimes I'll only need to run the 7 VM, but at other times for software testing perhaps all 3.

    I'll probably use VirtualBox for my VM management, or VM Ware Workstation v9.

    I'm really stumped at the moment (as this is new to me), as to what hardware I'll need.

    Will a new i7 3770 with 16-24 odd GB of RAM and a single 2TB HDD work?
    Or am I better going for a Xeon Processor and lots of RAM?

    It's a new job I'm doing and I really don't want to be asking for a supercomputer to get this all done, but it's something I need..
     
  19. 3t3rna1

    3t3rna1 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2001
    Messages:
    1,452
    Location:
    Perth
    Has anyone had timing problem's with Windows and KVM before?

    I've upgraded all of my kernels to run Ceph and now my VM's time stops at random but the VM continues to execute. It could be anywhere from several hours to several days before it happens and there is nothing I can do to reproduce it. This morning I had 2 VM's with stuck time for several hours, yesterday it was 3, the day before it was 0 until the afternoon etc. If I keep getting angry phone calls about stuck servers I'm going to go insane :sick:

    All the machines are now Ubuntu 12.10 (3.5 kernel) and QEMU 1.2.0. Affected OS's are anything Windows. I've tried everything -
    Every machine type
    Every CPU option
    Every RTC option
    Enabled/Disable the HPET
    Every QEMU version up to 1.4.0
    Injecting args to stop PIT Reinjection

    I think it might be something to do with the in-kernel IRQ chip but so far nothing has helped. I've dropped the NTP sync interval right down to a few minutes but even that doesn't help since the time stops completely the server doesn't know when 3 minutes have passed.

    Can anyone suggest anything to end the pain?
     
  20. cleary

    cleary Mental in the Face

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2003
    Messages:
    4,243
    Location:
    Griffith NSW
    Do you have any sort of support contract on your server OS'?
    We run redhat here, that's who I'd be calling if I had the same issue...
     

Share This Page

Advertisement: