The enormous Virtualisation help thread

Discussion in 'Other Operating Systems' started by elvis, May 11, 2011.

  1. wintermute000

    wintermute000 Member

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    4.10.0-28-generic - just upgraded. Am I supposed to pay attention? I've always just apt-get upgraded at regular intervals

    re: docker, did defaults so I assume I'm using overlay2. I'm only running 1 node anyway with no orchestration beyond docker-compose ATM, though I am going to start labbing kube soon
     
  2. OP
    OP
    elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Ubuntu LTS gets "HWE" (HardWare Enablement) updates, which is more or less optional kernel upgrades from current-stable Ubuntu that are backported to the LTS releases.

    https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/LTSEnablementStack#Kernel.2FSupport.A16.04.x_Ubuntu_Kernel_Support

    16.04LTS shipped with 4.4, then got bumped to 4.8, then 4.10, and soon 4.13. Very handy for folks who have bleeding edge hardware (we regularly need updates for new model Wacom tablets on artists' workstations), but also great for folks who run virtualisation, network devices (firewalls/routers) or other things built off Linux and want to take advantage of new features in updated kernels, without needing to upgrade the entire userspace land at the same time.
     
  3. wintermute000

    wintermute000 Member

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    yeah that was a key driver for me going Ubuntu not CentOS - I wanted to make sure all the bits and pieces of my Xeon E3v5 and C236 chipset worked with minimum hassle. I remember the good old days well (dual booting back into windows to google how to get my softmodem to work in linux, good times... not).
    Would probably rather practice RH due to enterprise penetration, but oh well.
     
  4. Statitica

    Statitica Member

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    Is there an easy method for working out what specs you would need a server to be? I'm playing with the idea of two servers in two different locations, and I'm wondering if it is as simple as just adding up the allocated resources per VM.

    EDIT: also, am I correct in thinking that it is best practice to set up separate VMs for each area of function on a server? i.e. apart from the VMs which will be used for workstations, to also have (for example) a proxy server in it's own VM, instead of running on the main server itself, so as to compartmentalise each function set, allowing a modular approach to expansion (i.e. migration of VMs to separate servers if and when required).
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2017
  5. Myne_h

    Myne_h Member

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    Is there yet a decently working "Desktop hypervisor"?

    I've played a bit with OpenXT, and it has potential, but it's not yet at the "stick my main OS on it stage"
     
  6. s8n

    s8n Member

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    hi all, ive got a i7 4770 with the intel intergrated hd 6400. Im trying to get quicksync working in Win10 as I use this PC for blueiris.

    Im running 6.7.1 ESX and a VM image for Win10.

    I can pass through the Intel card to the VM, but I get a Triangle saying Error code when ti starts the hardware. As a result, its just using the standard VGA card.

    Can anyone assist? I want to pass it through for QuickSync and to use the onboard HDMI so I can output the VM to a large TV. I tried about 4 different Intel drivers from 2015 onwards :(

    Thank you!
     
  7. Digit

    Digit Member

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    Hey Guys,

    I'm just toying with some idea's around the home setup and looking to hear from the brains trust.

    1. Is creating multiple (2) gaming systems on one PC a good idea, or would you be better off just doing two separate PCs? The wife wants to be able to game as well, but she mostly only plays the sims lol, maybe others as she finds games she enjoys.

    2. Can you do an OSX VM? From either Linux or Windows? Just thinking this could be cool for video editing and I'd get to play with some Mac apps. If we did that would it be accessible at either station or would you require a VM instance for each station?

    3. Plex/media server on the base linux install?

    Sorry if I'm asking super basic questions, I've never played with VM's
     
  8. g00nster

    g00nster Member

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    Probably not UNLESS you required alternative operating systems (e.g. Win7) or run pirated dodgy games. You would be better off with Windows 10 & alternative logins for the desktop.

    It's possible to virtualise OSX but its breaks the licensing agreement unless you are doing it on Apple hardware. Have a search on google for hackintosh as you can get some guides and instructions on setting that up.

    No idea sorry!
     
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  9. wintermute000

    wintermute000 Member

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    plex works fine on linux. I run it on a container lol though apparently there are bigger challenges getting HW transcoding to work if you do that. I don't care about HW transcoding

    Why would you even consider multiple gaming systems on one PC if by that you mean multi-boot? Just give your wife her own login and install sims, make sure she hasn't got admin rights lol, done? If you're considering it on the same chassis it means concurrent usage is not a use-case. If you're talking about passing through GPUs to VMs and all that then good luck... can't see how you're going to have a good experience running 2 games concurrently anyway unless you're buying commercial grade GPU servers lol
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2020
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  10. OP
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    elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Falls under "cool, but pointless" in my opinion. Having done plenty of thin client setups (as in, build both the server side and thin client side from scratch in open source software), it was all cool, but if you have to reboot the core, everyone stops.

    For the cost of a cheap system these days, separate boxes are worth it I think, especially for interactive 3D (whether games or pro 3D).

    From a licensing perspective, VMWare allow virtualised OSX, but only on OSX. I don't know of any legal way to run virtualised OSX on non-Apple hardware.

    There are hackintosh options that run in VMs, but this is both against the license agreement and a lot of screwing around with drivers and virtual hardware. It might just be easier to find an old Mac on eBay that can run 10.15 (I fixed up my daughters MacBookPro last week, 2012 model that happily ran 10.15).

    Yes, Plex is officially supported on Linux. I hate Plex though. Much prefer Kodi. But, personal preference, so whatever.
     
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  11. Digit

    Digit Member

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    Good point on breaking the OSX agreement, cheers for pointing that out.

    Yeah I find plex turns off/crashes if I leave my computer for a day or so. Probably to do with my power settings, I'll investigate that tonight. Wondered whether it was a Windows thing though as I'd always head Linux was more stable.

    Yeah we'd each have our own OS and potentially do concurrent use, so she could play sims while I'm playing AOE or something. The power of the current Ryzen CPU's and large core count just had me thinking instead of two systems, I can save on motherboards and CPU's and spend it on graphics with passthrough. I saw Linus try it and got decent results but wasn't sure if there were things I'd not considered.

    That's a fair call, I suppose it'd be fairly likely running two VM's and plex server on the Linux server (base?) could potentially require reboots which would be annoying. I wasn't sure if Linux would be rock stable and eliminate those issues, cheers.

    Yeah it's a real pity about their licencing, I get it but it doesn't suit what I wanna do haha. I hate having more hardware around than is required, like my cpu has LOADS of headroom most of the time, so rather than getting ANOTHER piece of hardware, I'd rather use up the spare cpu cycles I have. Hence lightly looking into VM's.


    Haha, I tried Kodi, and did not enjoy it at all. It reminded me of a worse version of MediaPortal (which used to work get on my HTPC), but with Plex, I can eliminate the HTPC and just use an app on the TV and connect it to the server (my desktop). I think Kodi can do the same but I played with it late and didn't get it, then went, what am I doing, Plex works (mostly). Except the media player seems average (troubles with DTS/4k HDR etc on my setup)
     
  12. wintermute000

    wintermute000 Member

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    if your wife wants literally a sims machine go pickup a second hand ~haswell-era gaming rig second hand for $300 right here. Boom.
    I guarantee you'll burn more time and energy in getting your passthru-GPU-timeshare machine dream working than 300 extra bucks. Unless you just want to do it for the heck of it, in which case yeah why not.
    Or if you're itching for shiny, put together a Ryzen 3200G based system for her but that will be ~500 (maybe more since corona inflation / shitty AUD).
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2020
  13. Statitica

    Statitica Member

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    Interesting, I've actually been toying with this very idea (multiple gaming systems in one pc) over the last week or two.

    I figure that while some components will cost more, the overall build will be cheaper, and it ought to be more energy efficient running the thing.

    I've got two years to figure it out, so hopefully the tech has matured a little by then, but this is something which LTT has been playing with since 2016.
     
  14. yanman

    yanman Member

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    I had a go at it, at the time using this forum in parts.
    https://forums.overclockers.com.au/...-8-core-lga2011-cpu-no-listing-sales.1188021/

    That was 5-6 years ago with the 2670 xeon's but I killed the machine :| I built it from some parts including an awesome ibm workstation board, but getting the passthrough working without crashing was beyond me. It ended up locking up so many times I wonder whether I blew something on the board with all the hard power offs :( Anyway it was super fun to imagine a single box that could do all that.
     
  15. evilasdeath

    evilasdeath Member

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    I dont understand the appeal, if you want to run 2 different OS/User builds just duel boot its easy enough.

    Unless you need to jump between users fast there is no reason to go to the hassle of getting passthrough to work.

    Its not like you can setup 2 mice/monitor/keyboard on the same host at the same time?

    And if you want to RDP into one then gfx over RDP is terrible, and you need another PC anyway.

    The only time i could see benefot if you had some underlying server stuff that needed to run at same time, ie run a dedicated server on linux and app on windows and linux stays in the background.
     
  16. Statitica

    Statitica Member

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    I want to have concurrent gaming (or otherwise) sessions.

    None of that RDP junk. GPU passthrough to the VM, monitor attached right to the graphics card.
     
  17. yanman

    yanman Member

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    It was mostly for the fun of it, and the complexity of having all the home server + gaming in one box. Sadly the reality bit though - services need reliability and putting all your eggs in one basket is going to hurt at some point :p

    Now if i could do 2 identical ones and fail between them!.... :D
     
  18. evilasdeath

    evilasdeath Member

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    But how to you manage 2 seperate inputs to 2 different games, or are you jumping between them on 2 different monitors.

    Thats the bit i never understood.
     
  19. OP
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    elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    X (the graphical layer for Linux) can handle multiple concurrent sessions. Remember that Linux is a true multi user operating system, even at the GUI level.

    You can set up a standard Linux box with multiple monitors, keyboards, mice and the like, and have many people running off it, all in independent environments. The input devices can be tied to individual sessions.

    We used to do things this way (dumb terminals on mainframes, thin clients, etc). The nice thing is that it easily scales back to one user without hassle. Unlike other operating systems that were designed for a single user, and suffer all sorts of kludge and security problems when they scale to multi-user.
     
  20. yanman

    yanman Member

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    Other people have just used VM's in KVM, assigned a dedicated GPU to the VM and then connected the monitor to that port. If each VM also gets a dedicated USB controller for mouse/keyboard/sound then you can split that nicely too.

    But in reality it's not something you'd do for cost or even time savings as the work involved is significant compared to just running multiple rigs.
     

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