The future of piracy??

Discussion in 'PC Games' started by hosh0, Nov 1, 2009.

  1. hosh0

    hosh0 Member

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    Firstly if any mods think this isn't appropriate or whatever please feel free to close, just please PM me with a reason if possible.


    I was just in the MW2 thread and I noticed there was a bunch of people talking about MW2 being "out" on console. I then heard that both MW2 and DA: O are "out" on for console. That got me thinking, if game makers are trying so hard to cut out PC piracy and using measures like forcing people to use dedicated servers and even not releasing games on PC till months later or at all in some cases. Will all this push piracy on consoles? Because it's still PC users who put up all the console pirate versions of games. So will this in turn make them churn more games out in a hope that game developers see it isn't just the PC market that pirates games, or will it just force those who pirate on PC to buy a console and pirate there as it is getting easier and easier?


    I guess I don't think the measures taken by game developers will result in a reduction in piracy, mearly a shift in it. I could be wrong, but that's the way I see piracy going.

    Would just like to know if anyone thinks that the measures that game developers are taking to cut out piracy will work, or what other impacts they will have?
     
  2. SR71

    SR71 Member

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    I think the current solution, which is just to attempt to attach more and more copy protection to their programs, will certainly not be effective. Things like simultaneous release dates and better pricing for digital purchases of games would go far in curtailing some of the piracy problem. At the moment, being charged $100 to purchase some games digitally in Australia is nothing short of absurd.

    The way I see it, the push to stop piracy (a push in the wrong direction) on the PC will not influence piracy on consoles. I think that the piracy on the Xbox is definitely showing signs of becoming worse, in which we see games being pirated an entire week or more before official release, but it doesn't really have anything to do with less focus on the PC versions.
     
  3. irR4tiOn4L

    irR4tiOn4L Member

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    There are hardware key based methods that i believe can prevent piracy, period. For example, http://www.rs-computer.com/hardware_e/software-protection-dongle/rockey6.php, or http://www.audiomidi.com/iLok-USB-Smart-Key-P482.aspx. You can use software to generate a hardware key on any usb stick ( http://www.sharewareconnection.com/antiduplicate.htm )

    Software methods like steam also work well.

    Given this i can only conclude that piracy does not cost developers enough to justify bundling a simple cheap usb stick with their software and forcing users to use it.

    I think most developers are well aware that piracy is more a display of free-loading than lost sales. What makes piracy so bad is that there are no physical elements that need to be copied, but the technology to introduce them exists. But nominally theres not a whole lot more lost sales and many developers are clearly aware of this

    [​IMG]

    Publishers are making more money from games than ever and record companies and film studios are still making boatloads of money. Its not about the survival of the industry. Its about big business and milking consumers for all their worth
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2009
  4. warez_kid

    warez_kid New Member

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    Alot of mobile phone tool suites do this. (Unlocking/Flashing etc).
    But its only a few days / months till they are well n truely cracked.
     
  5. Oblivion-330

    Oblivion-330 Member

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    I don't think anything game developers put into practice will have any major affect at all on piracy. As long the internet exists, piracy exists. :Pirate:
     
  6. Domokun

    Domokun Member

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    I think game developers/publishers like to target piracy on the PC simply because it is more user friendly. The various scene groups provide a crack/patch with their PC game releases, and installation is usually a rather straight forward process. In addition, torrents have made scene releases extremely accessible to the average user.

    However, very rarely can you play pirated PC game releases online without a legitimate key/serial, hence, if a user wants to play online (i.e. multi-player) they will have to at least purchase a key/serial (resulting in the developers/publishers making a sale to some degree).

    Piracy has been around on consoles for a while now and was quite common on the original versions of the Playstation and Xbox (there may even be earlier examples I don't know about). As you have mentioned, piracy on the Xbox 360 is currently very popular.

    In my opinion, piracy on the Xbox 360 will result in bigger reductions in profit (at least in multi-player games) for developers/publishers than on the PC. Why? Because when you pirate a Xbox 360 game, you can use all of the online (i.e. multi-player) functionality without having to spend more than $2 AUD on a DVD+R DL. On the PC, you at least have to purchase a key/serial.

    I don't have the statistics, but I'm assuming that the overall amount of downloads relating to pirated games would be greater on the PC than on the Xbox 360. This (I assume) would be due to the Xbox 360 being harder to modify to play copied/pirated games than the PC. However, anyone who can disassemble their Xbox 360, plug in a SATA device to a PC motherboard, follow a tutorial, run an executable, and burn a DVD+R DL will have no problems playing copied/pirated games on their Xbox 360.

    The solution (in my opinion) for developers/publishers in regards to piracy on the PC is to create a game that users want to play which will continually be supported through updates.

    The solution (once again, in my opinion) for developers/publishers in regards to piracy on the Xbox 360 (or other consoles) is to use a disc format such as Blu-Ray where the media is quite expensive and the game file size would deter some users.
     
  7. Sorak

    Sorak Member

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    the only solution to PC piracy is a hardware modification, similar to the console way, of course it'll be circumvented but the mere difficulty of it will most likely repel 80% of casual pirates.

    if microsoft makes a software check for the intact hardware, it'll reduce piracy even further, after all, if the OS will start giving the user shit (like XP did when it phoned home and found it wasnt legit) it'll be annoying enough to just spend the 50 bucks on the game.

    the industry needs to wake up to this fact, motherboard makers need to start including it on their new boards.
     
  8. underskore

    underskore Member

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    making games more expensive is the solution? :rolleyes:
     
  9. irR4tiOn4L

    irR4tiOn4L Member

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    Guaranteed way to make a new motherboard line fail.

    Plus i dont support it. I think theres a big lesson in piracy about the value of free riding goods. About new distribution and pricing methods and cheaper music. I think corporate markups are too big (not necessarily in games but definitely with movies and music) and these companies undermine too many aspects of our justice systems. They also undertake many illegal or wrongful actions while bending rules to their will.

    Even if we want to do something about piracy, i dont think we should listen to the RIAA or coercive hardware manufacturers to do it. Its like wall street policing itself; the public ends up getting robbed. Piracy is undertaken on such a large scale that a proper discussion should take place. Simply taking the interest groups at their word and wiping out a giant proportion of unofficial national wealth (free-ridden goods) with it is not the best option
     
  10. Domokun

    Domokun Member

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    Well, is a Playstation 3 game (Blu-Ray) any more expensive than a Xbox 360 game (DVD DL)? No. Using the Blu-Ray discs would make it more expensive to COPY, not to PURCHASE.
     
  11. Kurosaki

    Kurosaki Member

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    i don't see ps3 games being anymore then xbox360 ones.

    As for the size deterring people. That only happens in Aus. In many places overseas, the broandband connections are so good, sucking GBs worth of content is easily done and so fast that file size is never a matter of concern, plus you'd never hit a cap.
     
  12. Philll

    Philll (Taking a Break)

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    That makes me want to pirate games more than anything.
     
  13. underskore

    underskore Member

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    by the time next-gen consoles are here the price of BD media will have continued to decrease and it wont be expensive enough to provide any sort of deterrent at all, even at it's current price its not really high enough to provide a strong deterrent.

    using a proprietary media format is the only way to avoid that issue, but that will drive up costs.
     
  14. -=ButFli=-

    -=ButFli=- Member

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    HOw is that any different to the old anti-piracy method of requiring the CD to be in the drive to play? Didn't take long for No-CD cracks to be released and I can't imagine a No-USB-Dongle crack would be any more difficult.

    In fact, they already exist. I can think of at least one application that requires a dongle but there is a work-around for the pirated release.
     
  15. Akimbo

    Akimbo Member

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    i have no hesitation buying blu-ray movies because they are worth it.

    do the same for games, and there will be no piracy.

    Take applications for example. They are all over priced because, business's can claim it for tax return.
    Buy Windows7 Ultimate retail for $4xx and that $4xx can be tax deductable.
    Adobe CS4, $3000+ for software, that's ok, you can tax deduct most of that.

    But what about non business users. We can't claim for tax return.
    And we don't make money off this software either.

    i see a market parasite at work in this software industry.
    Needs major overhaul.
    Otherwise, the warez will continue.
     
  16. Sorak

    Sorak Member

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    increasing / decreasing prices on software have no effect on piracy. the main reason for the PS3 not having as-high-as piracy rate as the 360 is because blu-ray adoptation rate is piss poor. and cost prohibitive. blu ray burners can go for as much as an entire console on its own.

    the only way to curb piracy is to make the option of piracy MORE expensive than the real deal.
    blu-ray burner ~ 150
    Blu-ray disc ~ 15
    modded PS3 ~ 50-100 + loss of warranty
    ps3 game = 110

    now the PC:
    dvd burner: ~10
    dvd media ~ 20 cents
    game: 90

    its far more attractive to pirate the PC than console.
    if its made more cost-prohibitive by implementing hardware deterrents on mainboards or GPU's even, it'll be made harder for people to decide between, losing warranty and possible dmg to their $400 GPU and a $90 game. at the very least it'll deter those ppl on the fence who pirate out of convience rather than for the hardcore 'rebels'.

    for instance, if its GPU enabled, new firmware wont install of modded cards, and will show their age faster when new games come out.
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2009
  17. SLATYE

    SLATYE SLATYE, not SLAYTE

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    Has anyone actually achieved this yet? The last I heard was that one group had succeeded in copying the firmware - but since it's specific to each PS3 they couldn't even move a firmware between PS3s, let alone hack the firmware to run pirated games.

    If that is correct (that the PS3 cannot be modded yet) then there's the answer to this thread. Releasing a game exclusively on un-modded consoles will guarantee no piracy, because nobody can use a pirated game.
     
  18. OP
    OP
    hosh0

    hosh0 Member

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    It will just encourage people to find a new way to pirate it and hence be broken.
     
  19. SLATYE

    SLATYE SLATYE, not SLAYTE

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    I doubt it. Plenty of people have been (and still are) trying to crack the PS3. None have succeeded so far. I'd be surprised if adding lots more people (especially since most of the would-be pirates are probably actually not very good at hacking PS3 hardware) did anything to help.
     
  20. Sorak

    Sorak Member

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    yeah its been hacked, but its complicated, it takes more skill than the average electronics engineer, and hense difficult to find someone willing. chances are anyone who has the skill to do it, is earning enough money not to need the petty 100 bucks for breaking the law. again, all about money.
     

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