The Great Big NBN Sticky Thread

Discussion in 'Networking, Telephony & Internet' started by Akh-Horus, Dec 21, 2016.

  1. caspian

    caspian Member

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    there certainly are many reasons for business to benefit from high speed internet connections. the point is that business already have access to that, it's there for the asking. yes, at commercial pricing, which is fine - it's a commercial grade service.

    planning for the future is a laudable goal, but if a piece of infrastructure was scaled to its end-state from inception then it would never be built, because it would be too expensive. that's why freeways aren't built with 8 lanes from day one, they get built with 4 and are then augmented in a few years when there's (a) demand beyond 4 lanes, and (b) a few dollars in the bank to pay for the expansion. you just can't afford to have billions of dollars of outlay sitting unused for years, because there isn't that much spare cash.

    as you say, there isn't really a need for consumer grade high speed services at the moment. there's another thread going at the moment complaining about lack of consumer grade (i.e. cheap) 10Gbps networking gear. same reason, Joe Average doesn't need it, so they won't pay for it, so no manufacturer makes something they can't sell. even though every single user with FTTP can get 100/40 on demand right now, (I won't even go into the >100Mbps services that nobody sells... because there's no demand for them...) a large proportion of overall services are 12/1 or 25/5Mbps plans. why? because people don't have a use for more, and they don't pay for something they're not going to use. that 12/1 or 25/5 service can be delivered by a lot of technologies, so the user doesn't care how it's delivered, just that it is - their main concern is when can they get it, because they want it now - not in five or six years.

    someone will be along shortly to say that the "problem" is that the services are too expensive. yes, faster services cost more to deliver than slower services, because more capacity has to be made available to do so. if Ferraris were cheaper, we'd all be driving them too. but a Ferrari costs what it does because making something go that fast is more expensive than a Camry that a lot of people are driving... because it's adequate to their needs and the price is reasonable.

    yes, fibre is long-term better. yes, it has lower long term operating costs. but it's far slower to roll out, because you have to recable the entire country. the theory is that doing FTTN and reusing HFC is literally twice as fast to deploy (which is years), and adequate to need for the meantime. then you upgrade later, as necessary, when necessary.

    the analogy is very simple. let's assume you have just gotten your first job, and you want to move out of home into your own house. naturally you'd like a big house with all the trimmings, but you can't afford that. so your choices are:

    (a) don't move out of home until you can afford your end-state house, in which case you are unhappy for years (still living at home);
    (b) live in a tent to maximise your savings capacity, in which case you're at least out of your parent's house, but you are unhappy for even longer (takes longer to save for goal), or
    (c) buy a house you can afford, and save for a future upgrade (in which case it takes even longer to get to your end state, but at least you have an adequate solution for the meantime)


    the correct answer is (c), because you need an adequate solution now, because the world continues to turn. it's the same for FTTN. it's adequate now, and we plan for the future. yes, that means spending more than leaping directly to the ideal end-state, but it's no different to Joe Average's dreams of the house and car he'd like to own when he retires after 50 years of work - he can't afford them right now.

    HFC is another creature again, because it scales further again into the future than FTTN - DOCSIS3.1 and technologies beyond that will continue to extract adequate performance from that network for quite some time yet.

    not even close, sorry. the claims being made are political claims, which as usual can't be proven so the people making them take that as a licence to just make numbers up. just like every opposition that has ever been elected has, and then immediately regrets when they have to actually deliver on their promises, and can't.

    in the meantime, regardless of liking it or not, the reality is that no politician will ever do what they have just spent the last few years in opposition criticising the previous government as being the wrong way to go about anything. that means if Labor wanted fibre, the LNP was going to do something different. if it had been the LNP wanting fibre, Labor would have done something different too. that's how politics works. if we don't want that, then we should stop changing governments every couple of years. the problem there is that our two-major-party political system delivers a seesaw solution between two extremes of most points of view, so the only way to achieve some sort of averaging is to boot the incumbent lot out every couple of years after they have caused enough disaffection to lose public support. that's a thoroughly inefficient way of going about anything, but while a subject is politicised, that's a function of our model of government. and since the NBN just isn't a critical item to Joe Average (who only really cares that they can get what they need now, cheaply) it's not a factor in what mob gets elected next time.

    I'd be delighted to see a return to a full fibre rollout, although I'm glad I won't be the person at the end of the project who has to wait five or six years on their probably lousy existing solution - and there's always going to be someone at the end of the line who complains loudly about it.
     
    sir_bazz and Tinian like this.
  2. Tinian

    Tinian Member

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    If it was, he was correct. The enormous increase in traffic is a result of streaming services.
    What in the sweet fuck are you dribbling about?
    Those businesses can have synchronous services. They could have them before the NBN. They just have to pay for them.
     
  3. broccoli

    broccoli Member

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    says who? who decided that everyone wants or needs this? and why does it need to be taxpayer funded? If Netflix (or whoever) wants to make people pay for tv, why don't they fork out for the infrastructure? I'm late to this "party", and it's not because I'm wanting anything, or wanting it now. I'd rather wait and get something decent than have the dodgy bros give me something right now that is of poor quality (if that's what's happening).
     
  4. Tinian

    Tinian Member

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    Rudd and Conroy.

    Why would trhey? Even Google has worked out it's better to leave it to others.

    So you're happy riding your bicycle everywhere. congrats. It appears most people are now sick of it and want motorised transport of some kind.

    Anyway... Does anyone have anything bad to say about AussieBroadband?
     
  5. broccoli

    broccoli Member

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    Could you please post a link to the data?
     
  6. Tinian

    Tinian Member

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  7. banshee

    banshee Member

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    Good news & "meh. Tell me something I don't know" news:

     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
  8. TRG.dOinK

    TRG.dOinK Member

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    Emailed NBN, turns out it is available in my area (HFC) and the checker now says available instead of 2020, thought that would be the case.
     
  9. caspian

    caspian Member

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  10. TheWedgie

    TheWedgie Insert Custom Title Here

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  11. isaakk

    isaakk Member

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    Had a tech confirm today that we are indeed "Service Class 10". Oh, the joy, 2Mbps ADSL for another who knows how many years.

    Meanwhile, on 4G backup with Telstra DOT.. http://beta.speedtest.net/result/6827910288 ..
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
  12. TRG.dOinK

    TRG.dOinK Member

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    So if the NBN website says 'ready to connect' like in my case, is it ready or is it not ready (according to the quote above)?

    If it is indeed not ready and all new orders are put on hold, then how are we suppose to know when it is truly ready?
     
  13. caspian

    caspian Member

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    order a service if you want one and see. if you don't want one, it doesn't matter much at this stage?

    I have no idea what will be done in the future in that regard. I can only presume that there will be some sort of announcement as work is completed in an area.
     
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  14. luke o

    luke o Member

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    Kalamunda (WA) NBN not too far away the main green boxes been going in for a few months now. Fibre run up the hill closed a lane of traffic for weeks. Date is about March next year according to NBN site. Crap it's not FTTH still will be better than my current ~10mbit adsl.
     
  15. Alby1976

    Alby1976 Member

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    Mine should be in a few weeks, and with the node diagonally across the road, overhead lines, the run is approx. 35 meters, so no excuses if it is garbage.

    And Luke, I would be stoked with 10Mbit ADSL at the moment, sharing 1/3 of that with a family can be .......interesting at times.
     
  16. luke o

    luke o Member

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    Yeh ten mbit is ok. Last place I was in had one hundred mbit fibre to the home. Place before that I got 4.5mbits.
     
  17. kiwimeat

    kiwimeat Member

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    So we were meant to get NBN HFC on 17 December. Who knows when that will happen now.
    Not sure if that is a good or bad thing. Hopefully they will sort out some of the service issues but it still so depressing how the whole thing has been sabotaged by government interference and meddling from other parties.
     
  18. Ratzz

    Ratzz Member

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    I'm told my civil works will be done on or before Dec 11. Then I'm ready to go. Is this going to affect me, given my order was originally placed in March?
     
  19. caspian

    caspian Member

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    the info I have is that only new orders will be blocked. inflight orders will not be impacted. there is also a short grace period, so anyone who wants to order should do so ASAP.
     
  20. power

    power Member

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    mine is the 18th, tbh i'm tempted to just sit on my ADSL2+ until they sort this mess out. last thing I want is to end up with a shoddy service over Christmas when I know what I have now at least works.
     

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