The Guy With the Toroidial Transformer? Any Updates?

Discussion in 'Extreme and Water Cooling' started by Quadbox, Jul 4, 2001.

  1. Quadbox

    Quadbox Member

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    Yeah, sorry I've forgotton what your handle was. But until agg lets us look at the old forums, I'm not going to know.

    So, anyway, did you build it? Any experiences to share?

    'Cos I'm so thinking about the same thing.
     
  2. Lamb_Chode

    Lamb_Chode Member

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    wtf is a torodial transformer???

    amd this is comeing from a guy who thought he knew allmost all forms of cooling
     
  3. Lamb_Chode

    Lamb_Chode Member

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    wtf is a torodial transformer???

    and this is coming from a guy who thought he knew allmost all forms of cooling
     
  4. Lamb_Chode

    Lamb_Chode Member

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    opps sorry double post :(
     
  5. OP
    OP
    Quadbox

    Quadbox Member

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    A toroidial transformer is a transformer with both primary and secondary coils rapped around a toroidal (doughnut shaped) former. They have major advantages in size, efficiency, electro-magnetic emmisions, etc.

    The guy in question was building an unregulated toroidial supply to power a 180W pelt. Just shoving the secondary coil of an altronics 300W 12V transformer through a bridge rectifier and shoving a 10mF (yes, this isnt a typo) capacitor in parralel and hooking it up to the pelt. Anyway, the point of it, is it'll cost about $100, have rather a lot of power, and be rather compact.

    The lengths we go to to power tecs:)
     
  6. microsniper

    microsniper Member

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    Hey quadbox! I am glad someone is still actually interested the toroidal ps project.
    :)
    I only realised today that the forum was back up when my friend told me...
    The Toroidal PS worked beautifully during testing... it was some time ago and I can't quite remember exact voltage figures I got out of it right now... I just came back from 2 week Holiday in Korea and just totalled my car.... ):( so my cooling project is progressing a bit slow right now...it's about 80% complete...

    I will fire up the PS and take some photos for ya this weekend... you will also see previews of my ultimate cooling box then....
    ;)

    til then..cheers
     
  7. Corporal_Hicks

    Corporal_Hicks Member

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  8. OP
    OP
    Quadbox

    Quadbox Member

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    Thanks Microsniper, I'll be awaiting with interest:)
     
  9. Predator

    Predator Member

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    Do you guys know a good place to get transformers in Aust? I've been looking but I can't find any worthwhile ones.:confused:
     
  10. microsniper

    microsniper Member

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    jaycar and altronics
     
  11. D F

    D F Member

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    Right... I can under stand a 1 farad cap, @ about 20v for car audio applications, (it was about the size of 3 tims end to end) but not 10 mega farad, what voltqe are you talking aout here?
    10,000,000 farad @ about 20 volts? OR does the m stand for mili or micro? :confused:
     
  12. cerberos

    cerberos Member

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    tip prefexes in caps are for the powers greater than 10 and the ones in smalls are less than 10

    ie M = mega
    m = milli
    u (mu) = mirco
    G - giga
    b = bit
    B = byte
    K = kilo
    k = stupid fuckwit who doesn't know shit about computers


    therefore Mb and MB are sensicle and useful
    but mB or mb is stupid.
     
  13. microsniper

    microsniper Member

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    Here are the photos

    Here is the link to the photos of my project..it is incomplete but gives you a preview of what it's gonna be like. It has a toroidal PSU to power peltiers as pointed out by quadbox..
    I didn't add any comments to the photos as the project is not complete yet and I don't want to give too much info away yet...

    http://www.overclockers.com.au/pcdb/view.php?page=pics&name=microsniper3

    enjoy..
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2001
  14. cerberos

    cerberos Member

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    mmm your famous
     
  15. D F

    D F Member

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    ahh, looking at your photo there, you got a 10,000 uf capacitor, well does not impress me at all, infact, i got 11,000 uf right here, (well really they are made of 5 22,000 25v caps from a power supply from a really old HUGE fax machine... Get 1 farad, that would impress me.... Though I do note that yours is 50 volts....
    You might want to check the ripple of your ps underl oad, and i quote from oatley electronics... "Switching on and off a Peltier below 2KHz frequency causes increased thermal stress on the device" well, in your case, you are not exactly swiching it on and off, though you are still throbbing it at 50 htz, which could be of concern if the voltage is bouncing up and down too much...
     
  16. MWP

    MWP Member

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    Welll with the "Switching on and off a Peltier below 2KHz frequency causes increased thermal stress on the device" in mind, i dont see how using a mains transformer can be a viable replacment for a switchmode powersupply.

    To be able to smooth the 100Hz sine to say less than even 25% ripple from the full-wave bridge rectifier you would need a huge amount of caps (im not gonna do the math now). Im thinking that number of caps will easily out price a few old AT PSUs or even a newer high power ATX PSU. Also, the room required for that many caps will take as much space a 2 PSUs.
    And your 10mF = 10,000uF (cap sizes aint normally expressed in "milli") wont even get close to reducing the ripple to 95% at which point its not really worth having the cap there at all.

    Its not really worth it... i must admit tho, it good that someone is trying to do it anyway.
    Maybe a peltier with even 80% ripple will still work well and for a long time. Although youll no where near be able to get the peltier working at full power as youll have to run it a say 18Vpp for a 18V peltier. You must note here too, that the voltage output of the secondary windings are in RMS not Vpp (volts peak-to-peak).
    So if you put a 15V peltier on a 12V torodial, itll get fried in no time (no smoke, but itll just create heat and not move it).

    Some things to think about.
     
  17. cerberos

    cerberos Member

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    u'mmm i doubt 12v RMS would blow a 15v tec, as the peak volatge of that is around 16v which isn't that high for the tec, its just a voltage that would create more heat than at 15v and not move anymore, but even with only corecting the wave by 95% wouldn't that keep the peaks under 15v?
     
  18. microsniper

    microsniper Member

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    :D
    Good too hear some interesting technical replies.. thanks guys..

    well, all your comments are valid... I guess.. for sure, you guys sound like you know more about electronics then I. I only wish that you guys could see the post on this PSU in the previous forum.

    To heat up the argument btw some of you here are some more details:
    TEC I use is 24V 170W peltier.
    The output voltage from PSU is 18.2 V after rectification

    I was aware that the TEC would not work as efficiently with this setup but what thermal stress??? I saw no overheating on my TEC, is it suppose to burn up or something?

    I do have couple of 1 farad car audio caps left over from my stereo project, may be I should mount them to my case. heh he.. that would look insanely cool...but No~~~ caps that big would just blow the rectifier wouldn't it? it would take too long to top them up during startup.

    If I only could find a 24V PSU like the one DrROM had...

    Anyway, where are you quadbox? I'd like to hear from you..




    :)
     
  19. Predator

    Predator Member

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    I was wondering if you guys could explain what went wrong with this experiment I did with an old AT PSU. (I have next to no idea how one of these PSU's work). I was aiming to get a 15-16V rail out of it.

    I opened it up and traced the +5V rail back to where it was rectified. It appeared to be a HWBR, rectifying 11VAC. I drilled two holes into the tracks on the PCB and inserted a FWBR, a 200uf cap and a molex connector. I turned it on and measured 40V DC. This seemed really odd to me (given it was 11VAC) so I tried changing caps to 0.47uf, and got 25V DC. I bought another AT PSU and got similar results.

    Why was I getting such huge voltages (and is there anything I can do to fix it)?
     
  20. FyreBlade

    FyreBlade Member

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