The Large Hadron Collider: Could it destroy the Earth?

Discussion in 'Science' started by Goth, Sep 1, 2007.

?

Are you concerned that operation of LHC might destroy the earth?

  1. Yes, i'm concerned about it.

    26 vote(s)
    9.1%
  2. Not concerned, let's do it, the project wouldn't be undertaken if the risks were significant.

    220 vote(s)
    76.9%
  3. Not sure.

    40 vote(s)
    14.0%
  1. Goth

    Goth Grumpy Member

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    No, of bloody course it won't.


    As with the Relativistic Heavy Ion Collider (RHIC), people both inside and outside of the physics community have voiced concern that the LHC might trigger one of several theoretical disasters capable of destroying the Earth or even the entire Universe. Advances in particle accelerator technology allow for highly tuned particle collisions of ever greater energy. As the collision energy increases beyond previously achieved levels, the concern is that potentially dangerous phenomena may be observed. However, RHIC has been running since 2000 and has generated no such disasters.

    Disaster scenarios typically involve the following theoretical events:

    * Creation of a stable black hole
    * Creation of strange matter that is more stable than ordinary matter
    * Creation of magnetic monopoles that could catalyze proton decay
    * Creation of a stranglet

    It is possible that the Large Hadron Collider will create tiny, fleeting black holes. To address this and other concerns, CERN performed a study to investigate whether such dangerous events as micro black holes, strangelets, or magnetic monopoles could occur. The report concluded, "We find no basis for any conceivable threat." If black holes are produced, they are expected to evaporate almost immediately via Hawking radiation. This claim has been disputed; the existence of Hawking radiation has not been experimentally observed, and in academia there is some question, albeit among a minority of scientists, of whether the Hawking radiation theory is correct.

    Despite these concerns, a strong argument for the safety of colliders such as the LHC comes from the simple fact that cosmic rays hitting earth generate higher energy events than the LHC, obviously without causing catastrophes.

    http://www.misunderstooduniverse.com/France_Builds_Doomsday_Machine.htm

    http://www.lhcdefense.org/

    :rolleyes:

    :rolleyes::rolleyes:

    Whoever comes up with this stuff has been reading too much Dan Brown.

    What do you think?

    If people want more background info posted to help you decide, let me know.

    http://mketchum.smugmug.com/gallery/3316157#184519224

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Large_Hadron_Collider

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relativistic_Heavy_Ion_Collider

    One of CERN's safety study reports:

    http://doc.cern.ch/yellowrep/2003/2003-001/p1.pdf

    A fantastic photo of one of ATLAS's end caps, showing the muon chambers. Note that this photo is massive, and will rape your intertubes, but is well worth it:

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6c/Atlas_detector_CERN_feb2007.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2007
  2. Rezin

    Rezin Member

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    Which scientists? And how did they come up with that estimated time? I know SFA about these things but this whole paragraph seems like total BS to me.
     
  3. Assasinator_2

    Assasinator_2 (Banned or Deleted)

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    That's because it is.
     
  4. rtscts

    rtscts Member

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    Please tell me this is a parody site? At least it's on the intarwebs - publishing that kind of fearmongering shite in a major newspaper (as a serious article) should be grounds for imprisonment, on a good day.
     
  5. hlokk

    hlokk Member

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    The first sentence expresses my thoughts exactly. Its not like scientists are going "weeell, we could create a black hole, but we're not going to think about it. We're just going to hope for the best that it doesnt happen"

    Could you imagine:
    "Hey, you, want to buy some antimatter?"
    *the man opens his trenchcoat exposing a vial with a bit of black matter in the bottom*
    "Capable of blowing up a whole city, only 30 million dollars".


    Any journalist who thinks that a terrorist is just able to steal half a gram of antimatter does not know anything about it.
     
  6. fluxme

    fluxme Member

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    Are these the same tiny black holes like the one under my desk that keeps eating my pens and the one inside my couch that keeps hiding my remotes? cause if they are i don't think we need anymore of them.
     
  7. Cabbagesquirrel

    Cabbagesquirrel Member

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    mini blackhole in my cuboard, keeps eating socks and sometimes undies :weirdo:

    on a serious note, i'm in no need for panic mode, if they do end up making a horrible earth shattering black hole, 4min 30second is enough time for me to go huh well, shit happens and probably make out with any hot chick within arms reach.

    other than that i hope CERN get to explore all the cool stuff like anti matter and what not, i'm crossing my fingers for a feasible warp drive in the next fifty years :D go star trek hehe.
     
  8. genesis

    genesis Member

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    AGHHHHHH !!!

    We are all going to Die ........

    :Paranoid:
     
  9. TrennaHowar

    TrennaHowar Member

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    awsome post goth. Digging it alot.
     
  10. dantheman65

    dantheman65 Member

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    Hey man wanna buy some antimatter?

    Oh shit where is the suitcase I was storing it in *DESTROYED*.
     
  11. OP
    OP
    Goth

    Goth Grumpy Member

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    Hmm.

    There are people voting yes, i am concerned, in the poll, but they're absent from the thread?

    Why don't they share their thoughts? There will be interesting, polite discussion involved, no doubt.
     
  12. nEBUz

    nEBUz Member

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    Wow. Well people believed that going faster than was possible on a horse would kill you at one point too...

    Granted, it would be possible to sell terrorists antimatter, but to get half a gram would take quite a few years at the current rate of around 10 ng (nano grams) per year.... (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antimatter)

    And well, I guess I'm happy to take the risk that scientists can make a black hole that consumes the earth... if they do I'd not only be very impressed, slightly annoyed and probably wouldn't even know it had happened until i ceased to exist or got zapped to another dimension or something =D
     
  13. Smegger

    Smegger Member

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    But look on the bright side, your life expectancy would suddenly increase and we'd all get to watch the end of the universe from the wrong side of the event horizon. OK we may be a little stretched but that's the price one pays I suppose....
     
  14. inoshiro

    inoshiro Member

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    Yes... Because there were some indications that a black hole at the centre of the planet would target only France. :rolleyes:

    Crashing stuff together at stupidly high speeds. That my friends is science!! :D
     
  15. Rezin

    Rezin Member

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    Not only that but it would "plummet" to the core of the earth instead of just doing its business from wherever it was created.

     
  16. Hohne

    Hohne Member

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    My exact thoughts... if only they knew how unrealistic the stuff he writes about is.
     
  17. nux

    nux Member

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    I guess it would be alright if it just took out France, or at the very least the whole planet in a few years. But between 3 and 7 minutes? No way :rolleyes:
     
  18. OP
    OP
    Goth

    Goth Grumpy Member

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    Here we go.

    CERN's Spotlight on Angels and Demons.
     
  19. rtscts

    rtscts Member

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    The relevant section for the lazy:
    Uncontrolled terrestrial black holes are just as implausible. Where are you going to get enough mass to create a hazardous gravitational field or the energy to collapse it into a singularity?
     
  20. SLATYE

    SLATYE SLATYE, not SLAYTE

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    I'm much more worried about the intelligence of the Earth's journalists than the possibility that the LHC will destroy the planet.

    Well, you never know. The Germans might want to teach France a lesson for WW2, and they're normally pretty good at engineering. They might persuade the black hole to just take out France.


    I think that this dodgy journalism is a good thing. Terrorists will spend billions of dollars trying to make antimatter and black holes because according to the newspapers that'll make destroying cities easy. It'll be really easy to find their facilities because it's pretty hard to hide hundreds of kilometres of particle accelerator (and the power stations required to run it).
     

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