The mess that is AM5 Chipsets!!!

Hmmm..

I thought.. this was pretty much the definitive article to sort things out for me..

Guide to AMD Ryzen AM5 Motherboard Chipsets | TechSpot

Given its seem that that the X670E boards were basically X870e boards. without manditory USB4 support, I snapped a couple... during the run out..

Now the dollar has fallen, I thought, I better get whatever upgrades now, before the exchange rate adjustments filter through..

Then i found this

ASRock B650 Steel Legend WiFi Motherboard | Motherboards | Scorptec Computers

WTF. A B650 motherboard with both PCI-express 5.0 on the GPU slot and on the M2 slot as well....
Doesn't that make it a B650E motherboard.....

and if its a B650E motherboard.. that pretty much makes it a X870 motherboard without compulsory USB4 support???

$309 for essentially a X870 motherboard without the USB4 support, with good VRMs...

Just before buying.. I started looking at the B850 motherboards as well..

the B850 is basically a X870 with Pci express 5.0 support on the NVME CPU M2..and PCI-express 4.0 on the GPU slot... right?

However, there a whole pile of B850 motherboards with PCI-express 5.0 support on the GPU slot.
GIGABYTE's AMD B850 Motherboards Are All PCIe 5.0 Supported and Ready to Unleash Full Potential

Hmmm.. if a B850 motherboard has PCI-express 5.0 on the GPU and M2.. doesn't that basically make it a X870 motherboard without the compulsory USB4 support?

Also whats the deal with the GPP lanes..
AMD AM5 chipsets explained (X870E, X870, B850, B840 & all the others)
I presume. the four lanes are simply used as an additional 4.0 M2 slot from the CPU.

After all that... my conclusion for best band for buck is to either buy the
Asrock B650 Steel legend WIFI for $309 or
ASRock B650 Steel Legend WiFi Motherboard | Motherboards | Scorptec Computers
The MSI B850-P WIFI for $319 - 8 = $311
MSI B850-P WIFI AM5 DDR5 ATX Motherboard [PRO B850-P WIFI]
has old crap audio, and no reviews on the VRMs (12+2+1).. yet.. if the follows the pattern for the older MSI B650-P PRO it should be okay..
or
Asrock B850 Pro RS wifi - $325
ASRock B850 Pro RS WiFi Motherboard | Motherboards | Scorptec Computers


All have PCIexpress 5.0 on the GPU and CPU primary M2 and should be functionally equilavent to the X870
?right...

Then the question also is.. what tis the difference between all these
AMD Socket AM5 Motherboards | Scorptec Computers
besdies the Wifi, audiochip, Heatsinks and Sata support.. are they all functionally identical.??
ASRock > Motherboard Compare Result


Then.. there's this to contend with

Over 100 AMD Ryzen 9800X3D User Reported CPU Death, Most With ASRock Motherboards - Lowyat.NET


All comments to this crazy confusion appreciated...

 

TLDR

Bought a MSI MPG B650 CARBON WIFI second hand from sammy_b0i for a song and it's been absolutely amazing.

PCI 5 and USB 4 for most people (gamers and otherwise) are completely unnecessary at this point in time.

 

Always nice to future proof…
And given the potential longevity of the am5 socket..
Pciexpress 5.0 … may well be optimal for future videocard

Agreed .. At this point in time.. there is no need..

 

i saw that asrock board some time ago. yeh.. but didnt know anything specific about its config. just the price for a 650 platform (was appealing). so, thanks for the info.
14+2+1. looks decent enough.

but that article about cpu deaths and asrock isnt inspiring. :-/ perhaps a bios issue theyve addressed according to the article.....

ASRock B850 Riptide WiFi Motherboard | Motherboards | Scorptec Computers
this aswell. but why pay more?
the steel legend is out of stock at tingalpa.

 

Yeah it's a mess. Basically, look at the specs of the board and buy whatever covers the I/O and features you want. Chipset be damned unless it's something very specific.

Seems the Bx50 chipsets offer the best value and as you've found plenty of modern I/O too. I can do without USB 4 but like the option of PCIe 5.0 for GPU and primary NVMe. So my last board was a B650E and my current is B850 (essentially identical btw).

I didn't know regular B650 could have gen 5.0 too. Maybe it's a case of the mobo manufacturer added the capability but it uses the cheaper chipset. I guess it's possible, since that GPU slot and primary M.2 connect directly to the CPU anyway.
The idea being if you do buy say B650E you are guaranteed to get a certain level of I/O. But it doesn't totally prevent the mobo manufacturer from adding it in themselves alongside a lower chipset. That's my take on it anyway.

 

Kelvin your though on the itx a620i?

 

The lack of Pci-express 5.0, and no overclocking.. and usually poor VRMs.. and 65W or 120W as max TDP
Means.. probably best to avoid..
the A620 msi is sometimes sub $100.., tempting due to price.. but the reviews. seem awful.. .. lots of thermal throttling.

 

dont care for pcie5 or OC, but that 65W or 120W and thermal throttling is a concern
what do you recommend for an AM5 board? just wana use my 7800x3d for max single core performance with Stellaris

Some googling shows that it runs well below 120W, so I just need to figure out what board can do 120W

 

Just some of the cheaper boards can rub CPUs at 120W.. you probably wouldn't want too, if there inefficient VRMS are dumping extra heat into your case..
Bing Videos
x56 AMD B650 Motherboard Roundup | TechSpot

Look out for the VRM b650 review.. there are some mistakes though.. eg the B650M asus prime.. is absolutely awful, despite the position on the charts.. (because they have review it separately in the past on their earlier charts)
They should have a B850 review up in the next few weeks..


Basically you want the cheapest half decent vrms..

generally the B650 ATX versions are better than the mATX counterpart parts..

The cheapy boards, I've been buying are the

MSI B650M-A - $180
MSI B650M- Gaming plus (note the plus) (around $180 - $220)
Asus B650M-E TUF Gaming.. (Around $220) - Ratz, has had some issues with this board though..
Gigabyte B650-M Aorus ($300+)
Then there the Asrock B650 Steel legend wifi..

At the $300 mark, you are verging into the B850 territory, where some have both PCI-express 5.0 on the M2 and the Primary 16x slot..
You are then into unknown territory... until the reviews get released..

 

Thanks Kelvin, I will go with the Asus B650M-E TUF Gaming, some bling bling ddr5 and a peerless assassin. off to centrecom.

 

From all the test I've seen there isn't much gain from pcie4 to 5,I was thinking of a x870 chipset,but I got a 2 month old tomohawk b650 for 190 off the forums,very happy with it.Next upgrade for me will be whenever I can justify it now,no more chasing latest tech.

 

Now there isnt much gain..
But in a couple of years… it may make some difference
PCi-express 3.0 is beginning to bandwidth limit some of the lower end x4 and x8 videocards..

AM5 is likely to be a very very long lived platform spanning multiple generations like its predescessor. AMD has guaranteed support till 2027 .. that at least one if not two more generations of CPUs.

picking the right board now may save you a lot of time, money and effort later.

 

All I play these days is wow and final fantasy and some old rpg,s my old fx8350,and 7970 still run the games I play even wow was get 120 fps on that old setup,so this mobo will do me till 2027 I think

 

If thats all you do, there's no problems..

AM4 boards and CPUs are still being sold new..
That b350 / X370 from 2017, can still perform well today..

With AM5 only 2.5 years old, is not going to be superceded in the next 2 years... and potentially good for much longer..
The B650 tomahawk is a nice midrange motherboard..(1st gen) without any Gen 5 NVME or video support..
It is unusual to pickup a nice AM5 at a decent price... there's usually no reason to upgrade, so any boards on the forums.. I am usually suspicious of.. either ram support is garbage / poor or boot times are terrible..

 

Been looking at the cheaper X870 boards.. between the $420 - $460 range..
For the extra $100 or more, you get USB4 and guaranteed pci-express 5.0 on the GPU and primary NVME..
But there appears to be a lot of compromises on the cheaper options..

Thought I found the best compromise here...
the Gigabyte x870 Gaming X WIFI7 AM5 - $421
Gigabyte X870 GAMING X WIFI7 AM5 ATX Motherboard [X870 GAMING X WIFI7]
X870 GAMING X WIFI7 Specification | Motherboard - GIGABYTE Global

However

Pluses
Good VRM AMD X870/X870E Motherboard Roundup: 21 Motherboards Tested | TechSpot
USB4 - as its X870 board..

Cons
Wifi Quick connect (if you loose the antennas.. replacements could be hard / expensive to find)
Only 3 M2 slots, however if PCI- express 4.0 x4 is installed in the M2B_SB.. the third M2 is disabled - WTF?? - pretty much only 2 funcitonal M2s.
Only 3 audio outputs and no SPDIF (typical gigabyte)
The adidtional PCI expressed slots are keyed 16x, but only support 3.0 x1..
8pin and 4pin CPU power - but shoudl be Okay.

MSI PRO X870-P WIFI AM5 ATX Motherboard [PRO X870-P WIFI]
Pluses
Good VRM AMD X870/X870E Motherboard Roundup: 21 Motherboards Tested | TechSpot
USB4 - as its X870 board..
Normal Antennas
4 M2s all appear usuable. (one is an 3.0 x2)
The adidtional PCI expressed slots are keyed 16x, but only support 4.0 x1, (several shared with the M2)
5gb Lan.
Dual 8 pin CPU power

Cons
Only one USB4- WTF?? - AMDS specs dictates 2 as mandatory for the X870
Only 3 audio outputs and no SPDIF

Asus PRIME X870-P WIFI-CSM AM5 Wi-Fi 7 DDR5 ATX Motherboard [PRIME X870-P WIFI-CSM]
Nice review here and summary..
ASUS Prime X870-P Wi-Fi Review - Value & Conclusion | TechPowerUp
Pluses
Excellent VRM AMD X870/X870E Motherboard Roundup: 21 Motherboards Tested | TechSpot
USB4 - as its X870 board..
4 M2s all appear usuable. (one is an x2)
The adidtional PCI expressed slots are keyed 16x, but only support 3.0 x1, 3.0 x1, 4.0 x1,
dual 8 pin CPU power

Cons
Wifi Quick connect (if you loose the antennas.. replacements could be hard / expensive to find)
Only 3 audio outputs and no SPDIF

 

Not sure how much it matters but the MSI X870 boards all have 320mhz wifi 7 where as other manufacturers tend to use 160 mhz on their low and mid tier boards.

 

Wondering if there's a decent but cheap m-atx or itx AM5 mobo/cpu combo i could use as a HTPC upgrade?
needs to fit inside a Silverstone GD02 case

Or is it too new to be cheap yet? Should i get an AM4 setup...

 

AM4 is hard to pass up but considering what is "cheap" aliexpress 7000 series is pretty affordable.

 

Was thinking this if i go AM4

 

To reference my own post here as to what I've just done: https://forums.overclockers.com.au/threads/amd-desktop-8000-series.1325323/page-4#post-19653649

An 8400F runs rings around the 5600X stock and overclocked, with the benefit of newer platform features and future upgrade potential.You could also splurge the extra for an 8700F, which is an 8 core with 5Ghz boost (for ~5.2Ghz boost with PBO & FMAX 200), another option would be the 7400F, all much better options imo.

I have had a great time with the B650 Bomber Wifi, great for the money. Don't fixate too much on the low VRM count, if you're planning on running a 16 core with max PBO then it might not be the board for you, but it's not going to sweat a 6 core. My MOS temps rarely exceed 50C with a peak overclock after several hours of stress tests.

Spoiler: Additinal motherboard rant and vrm yarn

With these lower end boards, just connect your reset switch to the clear cmos jumper while dialling it in (or buy a spare button for cents which is what I do). If you need more usb, buy an add in card or hub. I'm staunchly against spending several hundred dollars on a motherboard for minor features like these, especially if you're not running other flaghip hardware, the money is much better spent elsewhere, those $$ into your motherboard don't equate to additional fps. You can also bypass TDP limits through AMD CBS using manual PBO values.

I actually also run an MSI B650M-B, which was a super budget AM5 launch board (~$120). It is a piece of shit without wifi or even a heatsink on the VRMs, and I still run an overclocked 7950X from it. With this though, I will note that MOS temps exceed 90C over about 160W sustained so I've put an array of fans over them that kick in at that point, useful especially when stress testing (you can set your fan speed from MOS temp in MSI bios).