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Thoughts on 'splitting' cat5e

Discussion in 'Networking, Telephony & Internet' started by Professor Chaos, Mar 22, 2018.

  1. Professor Chaos

    Professor Chaos Member

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    I'm not a cabler etc.
    But I know enough to be dangerous :)

    Regarding cat 5e (well cat5/6/7 I guess) and rj45 sockets.
    We know that pins 4 and 5 are used exclusively for telephone and the rest for data.

    So here's my question.

    Can we not run phone and data down the same cable at the same time ?
    Or is there an issue with interference between the signals ?
    I would guess that the ring signal would be the main culprit due to it's voltage.

    Please enlighten me :)
     
  2. chip

    chip Member

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  3. caspian

    caspian Member

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    and no gigabit connectivity.
     
  4. OP
    OP
    Professor Chaos

    Professor Chaos Member

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    Interesting.
    Never knew those existed. No suprise there though :D
    I thought (or at least all I see in my very limited world) is that phones (pots and voip) have all shifted to two wire.
    But now I think about it. Data is one send and one receive pair. Hence that device swapping two pair for either device.
    But this is more a general quest for knowledge.
    Can it be done, should it be done, what problems will it cause, etc and so on.

    Caspian.
    So by splitting the cable, you drop potential throughput.
    Is that due to noise, or the unbalancing of the cable from the physical splitting ?
    Is there a guide or known throughput for this ?
     
  5. waltermitty

    waltermitty Member

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    gigabit uses all the pairs
     
  6. evilasdeath

    evilasdeath Member

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    And 100mbit uses 2 pairs hence the space for 1 pair used for voice, or for another 100mbit.connection
     
  7. OP
    OP
    Professor Chaos

    Professor Chaos Member

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    Ah ok well that answers all my questions.
    Many thanks all.

    PS nbn stinks. Down more than a hookers knickers. Yes just had another 3+hr outage. /rant.
     
  8. Pugs

    Pugs Member

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    Must have fruadband.. my nbn is pretty solid
     
  9. caspian

    caspian Member

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    he has HFC :tongue:
     
  10. OP
    OP
    Professor Chaos

    Professor Chaos Member

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    I had adsl 2 for ~10 years before being 'forced' onto hfc a few months ago.
    Had less issues with the adsl.
    Seems like once a week we lose signal for up to half hour in the morning.
    At least that's what it feels like.
    And just went through a major drop out since friday morning that's only been resolved or whatever this morning.

    Our signal is strong, 9db of attenuation on the coax (3+6).
    Original gateway modem and plug pack (both fried) were replaced due to I suspect a surge.
    Several houses in the street also had their gateways replaced on the same day, yet not one other item in the house was damaged.
    Only took 5 days to replace, then an hour to manually load the new mac etc...

    So to say I'm not a fan of nbn, is being very polite.
     
  11. Pugs

    Pugs Member

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    Have hfc.. other than scheduled outages for maintenance haven't had anything else like that...
     
  12. caspian

    caspian Member

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    the only way a damaged modem gets replaced is if the retail service provider reports it to NBN.
    NBN then come out and perform the replacement.

    if other houses in the street had theirs replaced on the same day then those RSPs reported the issue immediately, and NBN demonstrated an on-the-day response.

    my conclusion is that your RSP (or possibly reseller) sat on the issue for several days before passing it to NBN, because if not you would have also had an on-the-day response. maybe next day at worst.

    but hey, let's bash the NBN because it's convenient, right?
     
  13. OP
    OP
    Professor Chaos

    Professor Chaos Member

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    I dont remember exactly as this was 12-2017 (original install was 8-2017)

    I reported the fault to the isp as soon as i noticed it.
    they advised me they had raised a ticket with nbn that day.
    I got a txt message with the ticket number, probably the isp ticket number.
    Mr nbn didnt show up till end of that week.
    mr nbn told me hed just replaced the gateway and plug pack three houses down and had a few in the area.
    our plug pack was fried as was the gateway (lights on, no one home).
    replacement wouldn't 'update' mac etc via it's built in system so he had to make a phone call and get them to do it manually.

    as to when the isp raised the nbn ticket, I can only go by what the isp told me as the nbn has chosen to hide itself behind a wall of secrecy.
    IF they decided to front up and start talking to people, then maybe the publics opinion of them could change.

    I'm more than happy to pm you the mac etc if you wish to check what your logs say.
    maybe you can explain all the outages we've had.

    side note.
    I was perfectly happy with pots adsl. It was cheap, it was reliable.
    Of the few people i know (not that many) every single one on nbn has issues.
    Best part is, we all have to pay more that privilege.

    but hey, lets defend a clusterfuck that hides behind layers of secrecy.
    yes i know its all been screwed by every politician and their cronies that get kick backs.
    obviously my fault for thinking these retards are supposed to be looking after the interests of the people that voted them into power.

    as an end user, it stinks from start to finish.
     
  14. caspian

    caspian Member

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    *sigh* the NBN is a wholesaler. you're not their customer, your ISP is. nor did the NBN define their principles of operation, the federal government did. juvenile snark won't change either.

    I don't have access to the HFC network to look at your service in detail, but if you want by all means PM me your address and I'll look up the incident history and timing. wanna play? I haven't lost one of these yet.
     
  15. OP
    OP
    Professor Chaos

    Professor Chaos Member

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    Maybe you missed this bit.
    Or maybe not.

    "yes i know its all been screwed by every politician and their cronies that get kick backs.
    obviously my fault for thinking these retards are supposed to be looking after the interests of the people that voted them into power."

    So yes I am well aware that the nbn is a wholesaler and is being stuffed around by the politicians that keep slashing jobs and budgets.
    But how many people understand this ?
    I mean joe public, the unwashed masses.
    Surely if someone in the nbn actually got out from behind their desk and said something, maybe the nbn wouldn't be getting as much abuse.
    I know there are some things they cannot comment on due to nda's and national security.
    But surely they can say something in their defence.

    as for wanting to play. its not about wanting to play or win anything.
    All id like to know is where (isp/nbn/wherever) the drop outs are happening.
    so, yes I would love to take you up on your offer. pm incoming.


    "Then someone will say what is lost can never be saved
    Despite all my rage I am still just a rat in a cage"
     
  16. caspian

    caspian Member

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    apparently not enough understand it, which is why I keep repeating it every time it comes up.

    as I said earlier, I have nothing to do with HFC, you'll have to report that via your ISP. I will look up the appointment history that led to the replacement of your modem, because that's something I do have access to.
     
  17. caspian

    caspian Member

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    OK, your ISP raised the issue with NBN on 5 December last year. it was actioned and diagnosed within 11 minutes and the access seeker was asked to make an appointment time (which they are supposed to do when raising an issue in the first place, in case it's required later, to save delay going backwards and forwards).

    they reserved an appointment time later than afternoon, and they selected a slot for morning 8 December. I assume was done based on your availability, as there were slots for 6 and 7 December available which they chose not take up.

    the tech attended the appointment as arranged and the job was resolved as NTD replaced.

    all in all, if we subtract the two days delay for the appointment slot selected, it went from reported to NBN to service restored in just over 26 hours. that sounds like a pretty workmanlike job to me. one of the things that might have further caused your apparent delay is that you have chosen a reseller service provider, not an actual NBN access seeker. any delay between them is outside NBN's control.
     
  18. OP
    OP
    Professor Chaos

    Professor Chaos Member

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    I only have pics of the replacement gear to go by. and yes it was replaced 8-12-17.
    From memory i wasn't given any 'available dates', I was just sent a text message saying he'll be there on that day between 12 and 5.
    on that day the tech actually phoned me and said he was in the area, can he come early, hell yes please do.

    I'm available pretty much 24/7. I'm semi retired and there's a full retiree also here.

    Im sure others (like myself) would love to know more about this "reseller service provider vs actual NBN access seeker".

    I was under the impression that it went from wholesaler (nbn) to reseller (isp).

    Shame you can't see the faults and down time logs. Could be interesting :)
     
  19. caspian

    caspian Member

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    that's what your NBN access seeker chose on your behalf, and NBN delivered that. what the access seeker arranged between you and them is... between you and them. if their communication with you as their customer is lousy, that's not NBN's fault.

    nope, and it's nothing new - resellers have been a thing for many years pre-NBN. when I left Telstra I think Telstra had about 65 actual customers, and the old Whirlpool Broadband Choice had well over 300 "ISP"s listed - which certainly wouldn't have been a complete listing either.

    NBN sells products to access seekers. they may then choose to provide the product to you directly on a retail basis, or resell it to a downstream channel partner, who acts as the retailer. that's your situation.
     
  20. LostBenji

    LostBenji Member

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    Up a tower somewhere....
    Fark me, talk about derailed thread....
     

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