Ubuntu Advert

Discussion in 'Other Operating Systems' started by neotheo, Jul 24, 2010.

  1. v81

    v81 Member

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    Well said.


    @elvis, looking outside the corporate world at the uptake of apps like Firefox and Thunderbird as well as other favourites that have risen to prominence over a number of years by reputation and word of mouth alone would suggest questionable marketing doesn't always win out.
     
  2. Swathe

    Swathe (Banned or Deleted)

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    That might be so but I feel that if it made a headway in corporate circles then people who work with it would soon see how much better off they could be on their home machines.

    I still think the biggest thing that is Microsofts "saving grace" in the enterprise environment is Exchange server. I dont love it by anyy means, but i t is massively adopted and is a cornerstone of most corporate networks (in my limited experience anyway)
     
  3. cleary

    cleary Mental in the Face

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    Let's just keep it on topic please.
     
  4. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    I'm not suggesting marketing is "always" needed. I'd never stoop to such hyperbole.

    I'm suggesting that overall, positive marketing would help open source gain awareness outside of the handful of popular apps out there. Again, I only have to look at the huge volume of substandard software in every business that has won purely on marketing alone.

    An easy example is where I work currently. Despite the massive prevalence of open source CMS (Content Management Systems) out there (and the massive cross section of languages - plenty of quality open source CMS packages exist for Microsoft IIS / ASP as well), my company paid AU$250,000 for a proprietary CMS product from a US vendor. The product is utterly horrid. Continual crashes and errors, non stop configuration issues, problems with dealing with reverse proxies. "Support" consists of access to a private forum where you hope that the small list of other users worldwide can solve your issues (because the developers themselves sure as hell can't). The list goes on and on. Yet when you ask the people responsible for choosing the product why they went with it, their answer was they didn't know about the alternatives!

    I then show them the massive list of quality, open source CMS products out there in the world and the size of the companies and public organisations that use them, and their response is "if only we knew about this before we rolled into production!".

    There's still a hell of a lot of businesses out there that don't even know it exists at all. Their adoption of Firefox has nothing to do with open source per se. In fact, I wonder how many Firefox users truly understand that it is open source, rather than merely gratis?

    And further to that, how many people do you think know that entire open source platforms and desktop systems exist? Particularly in business, where "ease of installation" is not an end-user problem, but a problem for paid professionals to deal with.

    I documented a similar response here back in 2007:
    http://www.stickfreaks.com/rant_linux_not_ready.php

    And three years later I still think it's valid. Trained Linux desktop technicians can easily deal with installation and configuration hiccups just as easily as trained Microsoft desktop technicians can on their platforms. Yet the concept of the former doesn't seem to even make it into the heads of decision makers in businesses, and I'd say it has a lot to do with a lack of marketing (and not just traditional advertising either - marketing is a whole lot more than that).

    Indeed, I'd challenge anyone who doesn't think that marketing assists software uptake to try and demonstrate to me a proprietary vendor in the corporate market who does not actively market their products. And for those that do actively market them, do you think that their volume of market share would remain if they suddenly cut all budget to their marketing department?
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2010
  5. Elyzion

    Elyzion Member

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    *shows ad to parents who have used Ubuntu*.

    "Whats U bu n tu?"
     
  6. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    In my very humble opinion, non-commercial end users fall into one of three categories:

    1) Majority share: will use whatever is put in front of them ("default install" crowd)

    2) Minority share: make the choice to use whatever they have at work/school and are familiar with (indeed, this is why I first used Linux).

    3) Teeny-tiny share: actually make an informed choice

    I don't think marketing affects the home/non-commercial market at all, for the reasons listed above. Most ad campaigns for software targeting home users have been very short lived (Apple's "I'm a Mac" campaign, for instance).

    What it will affect is the corporate sector, where big dollar sales are made in single purchase orders. That's where the mega-bucks are spent on marketing (which consists of a lot more than TV commercials - there's big events like the HP one I'm going to in Singapore next month).

    Linux.conf.au and similar events are a nice start mind you. But I still think there's room to grow.
     
  7. Oblong Cheese

    Oblong Cheese Member

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    I think this ad is great. I'm going to spam it on all my social networks.
     
  8. Menthu_Rae

    Menthu_Rae Member

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    Well that went well!

    Dell Drops Ubuntu PCs From Its Website

    http://linux.slashdot.org/story/10/07/24/0241204/Dell-Drops-Ubuntu-PCs-From-Its-Website
     
  9. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    I have to wonder about Dell's true motivation for dropping Ubuntu.

    http://www.economist.com/blogs/news...c_settlement?fsrc=scn/fb/wl/bl/dellscookiejar

    They just got an almighty slap on the wrist for taking kickbacks from Intel to ensure AMD chips didn't make into their systems for a few years. And these weren't small kickbacks either - at their peak it accounted for 76% of Dell's income!

    I get the concept of strategic partnerships. All companies have those, but they should at least admit to them, and not spin stories around it.

    The press release above to me smacks of the same PR nonsense. I'd hoped by now Dell could learn to tell the truth. If they want to make strategic partnerships with a single vendor, then they should harden up and admit it, and stop waffling on about the "complexity" of one extra product on their list of thousands of products.
     
  10. IKT

    IKT Member

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    surprise surprise?
     
  11. cdtoaster

    cdtoaster Member

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    who will come across yet alone install a OS no one's ever heard of without advertising? even the fact that there is not one OS called linux but that it refers to a family of OS will totally bewilder any non technical users.

    there is a massive difference between installing a different browser and formatting your pc with a new OS then learning to use a new OS so i dunno how people in this thread can dream to compare the success of alternate browsers like firefox. it also took a very long time before people started accepting alternate browsers and they became mainstream. the only reason other browsers became popular is that people who are knowledgeable on computers recommended these alternate browsers to noobs for over a decade till they slowly became accepted. same thing with p2p and the internet in general imo.

    imo linux isnt suited for people into/interested in computers because we tend to require specialised software which only runs on windows due to it being the largest user base.

    another problem with linux is that the people who it's most suited for are those who are least likely to use it; noobs who only browse the web and go on youtube. i recently bought a e8300/mobo/2gb ram cheap off the forums to build a new pc for mum. xp is no longer for sale and i wasnt about to install vista or buy a new copy of win7 and more ram for it so i chucked on ubuntu 10.04 lts and its perfect for her.i could also imagine it being used in corporate environments where computers are set up by knowledgeable people and end users cannot make changes, especially with ERP systems where the UI runs through a browser.

    another factor is that there havn't really been any linux operating systems suitable for end use, i've been trying various distros (xandros, kanotix, suse, fedora core etc) since 2003 and up until ubuntu 9 & 10 they've all had fatal flaws.

    with open office i have to say i prefer office 2007 onwards over open office but i much prefer open office over office 2003/xp and older. i've tried the open office writer on the ubuntu 10 and it seems fine
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2010
  12. tr3nton

    tr3nton Member

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    for e.g.?

    Based on your reply, I doubt you've tried it beyond installing and giving up after you didn't know how to do something. Care to elaborate on the fatal flaws?
     
  13. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Is that the royal "we"?

    I wrote my first computer program at the age of 6 (before Microsoft even existed), and have been around computers in some way, shape or form since then. I've worked on dozens (probably even closer to hundreds these days) of different software and hardware platforms from different manufacturers both as a hobby and as an IT professional.

    I consider myself greatly "into computers", and Linux suits me just peachy keen in both home and work life, thankyouverymuch. Indeed, the less exposure I have to Windows on a day to day basis, the happier I typically am.
     
  14. cdtoaster

    cdtoaster Member

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    anything from learning tools, file management, renaming and tagging tools, media backup programs, proper sound, video and picture editing programs, games, driver support even proper phone and gps support. on windows its always much easier and you get a lot more choice so why make the extra work?

    flaws like no ntfs support, no sound drivers, no video drivers, crappy drivers in general and just general ease of use. pretty much nothing ever worked properly unless you put quite a bit effort into it all. i didnt just give up i learnt how to fix most things but it seemed like unnecessary effort.


    we being the wider community who are interested in computers and are generally informed on various aspects of computer hardware and software. people dont generally start writing computer programs at the age of 6.
     
  15. stmok

    stmok Member

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    Hmmm...When did you use Linux? Which particular distro?
    (I'm trying to understand the root origin of your perspective.)
     
  16. bojo

    bojo Member

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    You were unlucky. I know this. I'm unlucky tooo haha. An ubuntu update partially borked some drivers for me.. they work but not like before :(. It is funny though, you complained about drivers not working out the box etc. But yet windows on the same system would involve you trawling the internet for the correct drivers.

    But the NTFS thing is crap. There is NTFS support that afaik was reverse engineered from MS closed ntfs protocol. IMO you should bitch about windows not having ext2/3/4 support more. They have the power and the documentation for that would be there, but they don't.
     
  17. Menthu_Rae

    Menthu_Rae Member

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    Eh? I can control my GPU fan speed, monitor my GPU/CPU/HDD/Mobo temps, stress test, get SMART data, benchmark my HDDs, etc

    I can edit images, view and edit RAW files from cameras, burn CDs/DVDs, extract various archives, create ISO's, edit movies, re-encode movies, etc.

    I can play games, bitstream DD/DTS to my receiver, image websites, manage downloads, download torrents, log into other PC's (running both windows and linux), run virtual machines, backup data over the network, etc.

    I can do all of this on Ubuntu with ease and all for free.

    So please tell me, what is it that you need that is sooooo specialised?

    P.S. I was even able to control the fan speed of a little propietary media centre PC (Asus Nova P20) I had automatically (according to temperature) and manually with ease and in very fine increments (via PWM).
     
  18. cleary

    cleary Mental in the Face

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    Folks, this discussion is heading in a direction that I can see leading to one of two things:
    * flamewar once more pro-win and pro-lin folks get on it
    * dying of boredom with an OT back and forth attempting to resolve/disclaim someone's technical issues

    The topic is not "fix every problem any ex-ubuntu user has had", nor is it a denial thread on the fact that some software only runs on $other_os.

    The topic is The Marketing of Open Source Software, it started out interesting, let's try and recover it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2010
  19. cleary

    cleary Mental in the Face

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  20. Oblong Cheese

    Oblong Cheese Member

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    There was no marketing push, at any time, from Dell or Canonical for Ubuntu on Dell laptops.

    Dell offered some laptops with Ubuntu, that was it. It was an option whose best selling point, at the point of sale, was a reduction of about $50-$100 in the price of the laptop. There were still "Dell recommends Windows 7" banners all over the site. There was not even a link to more information about Ubuntu.

    Dell offered it but made it as hard as possible for non-tech people to make an informed decision because they simply provided no information what-so-ever.

    This doesn't absolve Canonical of responsibility; they haven't spent any money on advertising either. One could argue that perhaps they spent all their money on making Ubuntu better, and that is advertisement enough, ala 'the proof is in the pudding', but in todays corporate market where it is always the best salesperson who gets the win, not the best technology ... this was a little naive by Canonical. Taking the pudding analogy literally: McDonalds makes quite bad food, but is one of the largest fast food companies in the world. Is that because of the quality of their food, or the pervasiveness of their advertising?
     

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