Windows 10 Creator Update bringing ads to File Explorer...

Discussion in 'Windows Operating Systems' started by NSanity, Mar 19, 2017.

  1. cvidler

    cvidler Member

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    Have to solidly agree with Elvis. Have run linux servers for decades (I was an early adopter), but swapped to a linux desktop full time back in October, haven't missed Windows.

    Have Xbox One S for some games. It works and boy is Forza pretty in 4k HDR.
    And while it has intertube access, it's firewalled off from the rest of my network. MS be damned.
     
  2. vladtepes

    vladtepes Member

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    Not to mention the fact that most Western military platforms / combat systems are run with highly customised versions of Windows.

    I can picture it...

    Scene: The skies over (insert Middle Eastern country of choice)....

    F-35 pilot. Hit toggle, deploy missile - fire.

    "Thank you for firing a missile, Before the missile launch please watch this short 15 second video..."
     
  3. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Every single application you can think of has an alternative. Can you switch over trivially? Of course not. But now you've got to make the hard choice - are you going to stick with the current ecosystem, with all the privacy concerns and ads forced down your throat? Or are you going to put the effort in to take control of your own systems? I can't answer that for you. Only you can, specific to your business. Likewise don't lie to yourself that there is no alternative. There are plenty, you just have to weigh up whether they're worth it now, later, or never, and accept the consequences (short and long term) of that decision.

    You *do* have alternatives. Whether they're worth the cost and effort is only something you can decide. But understand that you're making a compromise either way. Don't lie to yourself and say that you're not compromising buy staying in a bad business relationship.

    In isolation, this is somewhat of a false economy. With better IT people you'll get better automations, and find enormous cost savings in other areas. You mention CAD above - I worked for the largest architecture firm in the world back in 2001. They had a team of very competent developers who did things like automate the seating plan generation for large venues. When standards changed (say, chair width specifications were different country to country), they could bash a couple of numbers into a script, and it would go and generate a new seating plan and CAD drawings for a 110,000 seat stadium in seconds. That was thousands of man-hours of labour saved, not to mention countless mistakes that were caused by humans.

    *Everything* is going scripted and automated these days. Better IT means better automation means better savings. Stop looking at wages in isolation, start looking at what automation can bring your business.

    Outside of that, as in the first part of this post, you need to make a hard choice. Do you want to keep plowing forwards with the current bad relationship you have with Microsoft? Or do you want to change? Don't kid yourself that the current relationship is "good". It might be "cheap", but you're compromising in other areas, and you need to acknowledge that. Whether it's financially viable for you to change to something else is a question only you can answer specific to your business. But quite bluntly, if you choose to stay, you have little right to bitch about the current system when then only language your vendor understands is to change vendors, and take your money elsewhere.

    In 25 years Microsoft have proven that they don't listen to complaints, they don't listen to people pissing and moaning on forums, they don't listen to your whining to your mates down at the pub. They care about subscriptions, and when you pay the bill, you're telling them "thank you very much, please continue doing what you're doing" with a big smile on your face.

    If that's not how you feel, then find a way to get that message across in a language they understand.
     
  4. Gonadman2

    Gonadman2 Member

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    I think you may have missed my point a little. Philosophically there are alternatives, I'm sure someone has written some kind of database software that integrates with MySQL or similar. Or there's an excel type program out there waiting to be filled with numbers. I really should have pointed out the technical aspect - how will an SMB maintain interoperability with a client or its vendors who are completely windows based? How do we produce deliverables on a Linux alternative that a person using a Windows PC can pick up and use? I don't know enough about Linux to answer that question wholly, only that what I've seen would not even let me entertain the idea with management let alone move across.


    I've heard this argument before, however the IT people that I've come across have difficulty understanding the content of what we're doing. It's a bit of a double edged sword TBH. Most of our people are reasonably proficient with scripting, we would not be competitive otherwise. It is much easier to teach a technical person how to write scripts in a language to do a job, than it is to teach an IT grad process engineering.

    I agree with this wholeheartedly. Unfortunately our problem isn't a training problem, or even a financial one. Its an industry wide issue where everyone is sending data back and forth using Windows based filetypes and standards. Unfortunately for Linux and its applications, for it to be a worthy adversary in business, it will need to be able to seamlessly integrate with these filetypes and standards out of the box, in order for businesses to be able to continue to operate with vendors and clients that are not Linux based. (Maybe it already does?) My limited use cases have seen me delving deep into the terminal to perform basic windows tasks, let alone opening an *.accdb from a client or performing any sort of database driven design.

    Linux may have matured to the point of home users being able to work efficiently with it, but I'll eat my hat if an SMB is in the same boat for businesses that rely on interoperability.
     
  5. RyoSaeba

    RyoSaeba Member

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    Have been using Total Commander since forever. Norton Commander prior to that and Xtree Pro prior to that. :D
     
  6. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    I don't think so. The point is clear. You want an itemised list on how to break free, and I can't give that to you without knowing your business in and out.

    These are not OS questions. These are application questions. I work for a media company that uses Linux to deliver to clients who are WIndows and Mac. We can do it, because we put the time into making the workflow specific to our application base. You need to investigate the same thing for your business (or hire someone to do it).

    There are no "Windows file types". Your applications make files, not your OS. If you want to change, you need to look at the applications you use and why. You need to see if they are available on other OSes (the answer may surprise you - and sometimes you'll find vendors supporting other OSes on internal builds, and they'll gladly let you test them as an early adopter - it happened to us!), or if competitors in the market exist to do the same tasks on different operating systems.

    Plenty of people get caught up in the "I can't run AutoCAD for Linux" narrow mindset, forgetting that "AutoCAD" is not the one and only CAD program in the entire world. What you want do do is make technical drawings, and there are literally thousands of packages that do that. Can you switch to them? I dunno, and neither do you right now, until you do some serious investigation.

    The important point is - your business is a collection of tasks. Your computers digitally represent those tasks. Stop thinking brands of software, and start thinking about tasks. We're all falling into a trap of confusing brand names with things. I don't want "a Kleenex". I want to blow my nose. I don't want "to Xerox this document", I want to make a digital copy of something physical to reproduce it later. Tasks, not brands.

    Rubbish. And I don't mean to be offensive or aggressive, but you're being terribly short sighted here.

    20 years ago the business you're in now existed, and did so without the software you run today. 20 years in the history of your industry is nothing. What changed in that time? Lots. More than most people can even fathom. It didn't happen overnight, but it happened. For every person who tells me they can't change the software their business uses can never change, I can show you an equal and opposite case where people did exactly that. Again, it might not suit your business. I can't tell from across the Internet. But I have a feeling you haven't done the due diligence yourself either to objectively say so (if you can't name at least 5 alternative vendors for every single software product you use in your business, that's a good indication you haven't done the adequate research).

    Again, don't take this as aggression on my behalf. Whether you change or not is your call. But please don't fool yourself into thinking change is impossible. And if you don't want to change, then the results of the inaction are on you, and that includes your current vendors taking you for a ride (because they will, because that's what they do).

    Bigger picture - what risk are you bringing to your business by buying into formats that have no alternative? What happens when (not if) your vendors screw you over? What happens if your vendors suddenly decided to triple their prices over night? What level of control do you have right now over any of this?

    Look outside software. You want cheaper business insurance - what do you do? You shop around, change vendors. If I told you that you had to buy business insurance at a fixed price from one vendor, and that one vendor controlled the price that they charged, what would you say?

    Business tends to be ruthless in their search for lower prices everywhere BUT software. In every other aspect of your business you'll seek out vendors who do more for your dollar, except in software where you feel trapped and bound to a foreign company. That doesn't sit right with me in my business. You need to have a good hard look at your business and ask yourself if you feel comfortable with it in yours. (And maybe you do, which is cool if you do, but don't complain about ads in your file explorer).
     
  7. OP
    OP
    NSanity

    NSanity Member

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    my my elvis is some ranty today
     
  8. metamorphosis

    metamorphosis Member

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    I heartily recommend x2plorer free. It's the best. Dual file explorer tabs save more time than I can even.
     
  9. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Fuck vendors. Fuck 'em all.
     
  10. OP
    OP
    NSanity

    NSanity Member

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    I had a healthy dose of this today.
     
  11. Smokin Whale

    Smokin Whale Member

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  12. Ck21

    Ck21 Member

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    You can run windows software on linux, you can use wine (which is a royal pain for some software packages now that most flavours of linux dont include the 32bit binaries)

    or

    embrace virtualisation.

    Create a windows VM with the apps installed (7/8/ or a build of 10 sans the app integration with updates disabled), or if it suits you, a seperate VM for each app.

    so they can do their work in the VM while they learn the native linux equivalents.


    Where there is a will, there is a way, sure its more of a Dirty hack then easy 1step solution but hey, do you want off the MS trainwreck? or do you want to ride it till it hits the wall?
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2017
  13. elvis

    elvis Old school old fool

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    Nailed it.

    It's not about being anti-Microsoft or pro-Linux. It's about people and businesses being in control of the things they do and own.

    If Linux hypothetically overnight turned into the same privacy/control-smashing beast as a dozen other major companies are today, I'd dump it and look elsewhere too. I'm loyal to no third party, am extremely selfish of the things I own and how they're used, and don't apologise for that.
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2017
  14. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle Member

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    http://forums.overclockers.com.au/showpost.php?p=17495240&postcount=11 is very relevant to modern society with the gradual erosion of privacy and ownership blatantly occurring to such an extent they are now becoming non-existent and we are being controlled by the Corporations ever more everyday. MS is doing it and 'John Deere Destroy the Very Idea of Ownership' and GM are other very tragic examples.

    It is true there are a phletora of competent alternatives out there but what assurances do the masses have that they are not just trading one master for another that is far more sophisticated and deceptive in their control? Many of these competent alternatives do take a higher level of acquired/assumed knowledge to attain high levels of competent output.

    An open source OS could still allow for a collective of individuals to collaborate and exercise a similar control as MS currently has but at a far more sophisticated and discrete level? Where are the assurances and checks and balances that open source can indeed provide and maintain a high level of privacy with significant levels of security with a high degree of usability?

    Is there not a benefit that with the masses consuming MS (or macOS) there is also a higher volume cynics and professionals scutinising the products (including MALWARE sector) and finding vulnerabilities, exploits (privacy as well as malicious) and weaknesses than there might be with an open source product?
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2017
  15. Sledge

    Sledge Member

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    So pretty sure i'm not on creators update yet...
    [​IMG]
    But i already have that box to untick?
    [​IMG]
     
  16. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle Member

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    In the run box type in winver what Version are you?

    I checked the missus PC and she doesn't have that field whereas my PC (Version 1703 (OS Build 15063.138)) which is CU does have it.
     
  17. OP
    OP
    NSanity

    NSanity Member

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    he's not.

    1703 = CU.
    1607 = Anniversary Update.
     
  18. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle Member

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    True my oversight.......that's weird because the missus PC is Win10Pro as well.
     
  19. ae00711

    ae00711 Member

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    good to know - was considering.....alternative methods of procurement :lol:
     
  20. The_Stig

    The_Stig Member

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    Just checked and mine is exactly the same and I am on the same version and build. Not that I had noticed any ads as yet....
     

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