Zen3 Ryzen 4000 won't work on B450 or X470 motherboards

Discussion in 'AMD x86 CPUs and chipsets' started by stuhad, May 8, 2020.

  1. adamsleath

    adamsleath Member

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    for the pc.
    there needs to be 2 players in the game. point is that amd have had a good run. if amd 'soomers kick up enough of a stink amd might try harder on the bios front?

    like intel has been before, AMD are in a good position to sell their products now. on price/performance. bottom line is will they lose out on cpu sales if they dont upgrade older chipset bios's to accommodate a yet to be released 4000 series lineup? or is it in their interests to sell their 500 series chipsets :)?
     
  2. 335 GT

    335 GT Member

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    Ha not so sure about that.

    He drives me nuts though, he speaks so damned quickly I have trouble understanding him.
    He could almost qualify as an honourary Victorian. :D
     
  3. Rod M

    Rod M Member

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    yea I agree, he is hard to understand sometimes,

    I like Hardware Unboxed review format better,
     
  4. Urbansprawl

    Urbansprawl Member

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    Video is such a slow way of conveying information through, I'd much rather have something written.
     
  5. mAJORD

    mAJORD Member

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    I don't mind steve too much, but lately they've been doing just video reviews/ articles which just shits me since all he ever does is just ramble off a script ( he literally reads it off paper!) So why can't they just post the damn thing on website with pictures is beyond me
     
  6. RnR

    RnR Member

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    I know of people that hate reading... if they can get the same info via spoken words in a video they are much happier. And I suspect that its easier to get advertising dollars these days with an in-video promo. You can't skip or block these :)
     
  7. RnR

    RnR Member

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    So multiple people over on reddit are reporting that they have received replies from Lisa Su (CEO of AMD) on the topic of Ryzen 4000 not working on older chipset boards. They seem to say the same thing ie "Thanks for your note. We are working on options and appreciate your thoughtful input. Stay tuned."

    Maybe the nimble boat that is AMD is changing direction in the face of fan fury :thumbup:

    Source - https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/gkgmwf/heres_the_email_i_received_from_amds_ceo_lisa_su/
     
  8. 335 GT

    335 GT Member

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    They might allow the max boards as they are *new* b450's would be my guess.

    I wouldn't expect it on anything else.
     
  9. Phido

    Phido Member

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    I think its entirely possible that board partners will release a BIOS that provides beta support for 4000 series at the cost of losing 1000 and 2000 compatibility in b450 and perhaps x470.

    MSI certainly seems to have talked themselves into a corner promising all future AM4 CPU's on its 4x0 boards. GB and AS will probably also be forced to beta something out for the B450 boards. It may not come immediately. No one said it had to be launch day.

    As the german overclocker says, these are systems on a chip, they don't need any chipset to operate. There is no impossible compatibility issue, this is purely a corp decision. You can build a bios with 3000 and 4000 compatability in it, as most the b550 and x570 boards have 16mb roms. I don't buy "its too much effort" as the B550 and B450 chipsets are exactly the same with the same feature set. There is almost no effort or development required to allow this. It is the same Bios.

    AMD might not be loaning out CPU's for flashing.. Which again, is fine. Its about retailers and people who already have 3000 series CPU's in b450 boards. X470 people would have purchased x570 boards, but with 3000, there was no 500 series boards to couple with them.
     
  10. SnooP-WiggleS

    SnooP-WiggleS Member

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    Hardware Unboxed posted a follow up on their video (pinned first comment on their video)

    "Updates: AMD has refrained from commenting and therefore addressing any of our questions at this point, but we have had some interesting conversations with a few of their partners. Again to be perfectly clear on this point, board partners cannot support Ryzen 4000 series processors on 400-series motherboards without AMD’s help, it’s simply not possible. So don’t expect an AIB to crack the code and open up support, again without AMD’s support it’s not going to happen. It does seem as though this was a recent decision by AMD and their partners found out the same time we did, so that’s truly bizarre, but then given the last few product releases from AMD it’s getting harder and harder to be suprised by this stuff. I’ve also had industry contacts confirm that the AMD BIOS excuse is rubbish and that simple workarounds are possible, just like the one I discussed. In one example there would be a single large BIOS file that you download, then upon flashing you select the CPU series you want to support and it flashes the appropriate code. So at this point it’s now up to the rest of the community to pressure AMD into changing this decision and to open up support for 400-series boards. You guys had better believe that if you give them an inch, they’ll take a mile and we’ll be back to where we were just a few years ago."
     
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  11. RnR

    RnR Member

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    Thats a pretty decent idea for the enthusiasts. Probably not for the mainstream punters though.
     
  12. Phido

    Phido Member

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    Mainstream aren't system builders with existing b450 boards. Just release an unsupported beta bios that allows 4000 series support and 99% of this outrage would go away.
     
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  13. Elyzion

    Elyzion Member

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    Alot of info here.
     
  14. Phido

    Phido Member

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    Games Nexus finally talks to someone and posts video to correct their first video.
    Still sounds like a propaganda video by the mobo manufacturers. He should frame it as "motherboard engineers say" or "board partners claim", not represent it as fact.

    They are still selling B450 boards. This is the problem.
    We have different products for different markets.

    Jesus, who would have imagined that AMD promising AM4 socket life longevity would require for AMD to provide AM4 socket life longevity.
    Why does AMD break compatibility with every CPU so badly it can't boot. Surely if you want to keep a socket alive you would make it can boot across the entire CPU line.
     
  15. FIREWIRE1394

    FIREWIRE1394 Member

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    I got an X370 and B350 board in 2017, and it is now 2020, and the processors in stores today work.
    They kept the promise.

    Oh no, I jumped in and bought a socket at the end of claimed support... RABBLE!!!!
    WAHHHHH!!!
    Who could have predicted a 3 year old roadmap would be pretty accurate.:rolleyes:

    Maybe if they keep the Physical socket but things are incompatible, just call it AM4+ and then the problem is solved.

    I wish I could buy a motherboard in 2000 and have it still supported in 2020... But it doesn’t work that way.
     
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  16. Jazz

    Jazz Member

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    I bought cheap cheap x370 boards from the forums, and put 3600s in them for my kids. I'm not complaining about socket longetivity.
     
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  17. Phido

    Phido Member

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    Yes, but no one is complaining about x370 or b350 longevity, because most of those were bought a long time ago, and supported (mostly) up to 3000 series CPU's. Those boards were quickly replaced with b450 and x470 boards as time went on.

    What is a annoying is those that bought motherboards < 12 months ago, under the promise that they could expect x370 or b350 levels of support of 3 chips. Instead we get less than what the 300 series users got.

    They are still charging premium dollars for b450 chipsets. There is still no b550 on the market. AMD failed to provide a product in a timely manner. and X570 is not appropriate for many solutions (such as MITX where chipset fans and excessive cost of $500 are inappropriate (https://www.computeralliance.com.au...G6pV-v_UBLs6c_js-CzV448rD76TdBbxoCSvIQAvD_BwE)). We were told to buy b450 boards instead. Most retailers don't stock x series MITX boards, because well they are stupid as none of the x series features are able to be used on mitx form factors.

    The reasons for doing this : making more money.
    Result: Shafting users. Lying about products both from AMD and from board partners.

    They already did this with PCI4 on b450 and x470 chipsets. Board partners released PCI4 support even though AMD said it was impossible.

    You can't go harping on for 3 years about how intel breaks compatibility for money, and then go do exactly that when you specifically made comments and promises that you weren't going to do that.

    Its hypocritical. Its unethical.

    At least intel was upfront about its stupid behavior. There are hack bioses that allow the impossible to be possible for intel platforms. So you could say AMD is much worse than intel currently.

    Of course you might say what are AMD users going to do.. Thats a fair question, some will pursue legal action. Some will try to return boards and get refunds. AMD loses all credibility and any ethical standing they had in the wider community. Many will jump ship. The other point is many of us do not need to upgrade.

    Most people upgrade their computer because it feels nice to own something new. Each generation is only a few percent faster and computers today are massively overpowered. If people feel burnt, feel used, they will just loose interest in upgrading and buying computer stuff.

    Afterall who wants to spend money when they feel like they got ripped off.
     
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  18. Elyzion

    Elyzion Member

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    > Most people upgrade their computer because it feels nice to own something new.

    So upgrade the motherboard too?
     
  19. SnooP-WiggleS

    SnooP-WiggleS Member

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    For most people upgrading the motherboard is the least desirable thing, on it's own it doesn't provide any more fps in games, it usually requires complete pc dissembly. Dropping in a new cpu or gpu is much easier and of course gives performance gains. I certainly plan to keep my B350 board as long as possible and get a 3900x or 3950x upgrade when/if they are cheaper.
     
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  20. miicah

    miicah Member

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    When the point of the socket was you didn't have to?
     

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